06-02-2011, 12:00 AM
Bob May wrote:Nu Lang wrote:
Also, the right could open it eyes, take in the nagual, but then if it closes them again it took what it saw and adds it to self refection once eyes are closed, so the information it has becomes contaminated, in Buddhism this would be called 'ignorance'. But it also shows a progressive process, that each time the right could open its eyes, it gets a boost and centimeter of change to alter its interior view by taking in the nagual to impact its reflective state. Over time a momentum could gather, if there is discipline to do so, and thus the eye could become completely open, the witness. And this also describes what the third eye is...ever open witness.
Also at this power spot I pay attention to the behavior of people, they indicate what is happening in other areas and so the people serve as messengers in how they behave...what they say or do. Like actors sending forth spirits messages/teachings.I just answered this post and lost it accidentally.
Oh well, basically the principle you are talking about is in the story of Jacob/ Israel.
Jacob is the "supplanter" and "seeking after God"
His name changes to Israel "Grace or Favor with man and God."
Each time he has a spiritual experience his name changes to Israel.
Grace or Favor is a gift. It is not earned.
Jacob is called the "supplanter" (taking the place of another) because he tricks his brother Esau out of his inheritance and later tricks his father Isaac into giving him Esau's birthright also. This is well known.
But further, I believe that this supplanting taking place also has to do with Jacob taking the place of Israel.
This change of name happens several times. when he wrestles with an angel until the breaking of dawn (enlightenment). When he sees the ladder set up which I partially described above. And a very important instance where it actually says that Israel is Jacob's spirit which has been asleep, apparently.
Ge 45:26
And told him, saying, Joseph is yet alive, and he is governor over all the land of Egypt. And Jacob's heart fainted, for he believed them not.
Ge 45:27
And they told him all the words of Joseph, which he had said unto them: and when he saw the wagons which Joseph had sent to carry him, the spirit of Jacob their father revived:
Ge 45:28
And Israel said, It is enough; Joseph my son is yet alive: I will go and see him before I die.
Someone mentioned the coyote as trickster being the sorcerer's world or Astral planes. This sounds right to me. Jacob is a trickster. He is us.
We have a spiritual experience and turn it into an expanded part of our Tonal. We think we did it by our own effort.
But it is our desire to experience and know the unknown that brings us to these things.
Why are we different? Because we are Jacob. "Seeking after God." Seeking after the unknown.
But where did we get this yearning??? We, most of us were born with it, I think though maybe some got it later in life.
But most people could care less.
So the seeking after God (Jacob) that is a part of us is a gift (Israel) from God.
Don Juan said that Power dictated who would be an apprentice.
Jesus said, "You have not chosen me, but I have chosen you."
This awareness that it is all a gift, Grace, Favor, I believe helps us to keep the tonal from growing and taking over the spiritual side of things. Our world view expands but we know there is more to come.
Every time I've had what I consider a true Spiritual experience, (not just an astral level thing) it has been very different from anything I had experienced previously.
We are growing into the nagual as Don Juan might put it but growing in Christ in Christian terms. Fellow heirs, having recieved the birthright.
Going into a land we knew not.
"Surely the Lord is in this place and I knew it not."
"It has not entered into the hearts and minds of man what God has in store for his children."
It is beyond our ability to imagine.Yes, its a gradual thing isn't it. Like the right hand palm if we imagine its able to open it eyes with some exertion (maybe like when we are groggy with sleep), that feeling, so a bit of difficulty, but every time it opens its eyes, it becomes more like the left hand palm which is eternally open. God or Nagual. This is another way of saying its simply breaking that mirror of self-reflection that keeps one fixated on a self that is cut off from its environment to greater or lesser degrees. Power is the environment and also us. The reflection in the mirror is an illusion that drains focus and concentration onto trivial matters. Which may not seem trivial but using death as an adviser we see it is indeed trivial.
Such as the reflective process may tell us that an argument we just had was 'important' and the fact our view point was not heard was important. But if we were to then experience the wave of death upon us, the argument does not mean anything to us anymore and it never truly did (we may even wish to embrace that person one last time before we die, tell them we love them etc), only the mirror image held us in hypnotic suspension prior to realization of death. So then a person may ask, should ask..why am I engaging my energy in this futile way?
Here is the interesting part to me...once we see the futility of the argument, we may continue to engage with the person, except this time we do it with awakened awareness and intent (left hand). The other person may not know a shift occurred. It does not matter. Truth is, the world does not just stop being the way it is becasue we have an epiphany, in fact, we shift and thus we stop ourselves,simultaneously continuing on as if nothing different happened by external appearances, except that we seek to now harmonize with power around us (and with others) which will change our behavior away from its haphazard, careless states to instead focus new intent upon matters. It may not mean we apologize to the other person, in fact in some instances we may continue to stand our ground, sever ties even. SO, one cannot predict what those actions would be, as power adjusts continuously and thus has no fixed position. Power is simply an absence of self concern and thus acting accordingly to maintain the link with power. To enter into concern of self is to lose the link. So action is dictated by link alone and not any morals, cares, judgements that arise of mind/emotions.
Those who look for conclusions based on whats said and done will be mislead by what they conclude when encountering one who acts from power (only knowing intent informs here). A person with power has to live among fellow men this way being misunderstood, its called controlled folly. However, such a person linked to the nagual helps bring the light of awareness (power) into the environment by nature of what they intend and awareness they practice (expanded consciousness). I only mention this as its an added effect that comes along with power. One, as I see it, does not intend to save humanity, one simply seeks the nagual and to practice such awareness in ones acts to draw an even closer link. "Saving humanity, fellow humans" as a thought-concept is one of many mental deliberations (not of power).
Also, the right could open it eyes, take in the nagual, but then if it closes them again it took what it saw and adds it to self refection once eyes are closed, so the information it has becomes contaminated, in Buddhism this would be called 'ignorance'. But it also shows a progressive process, that each time the right could open its eyes, it gets a boost and centimeter of change to alter its interior view by taking in the nagual to impact its reflective state. Over time a momentum could gather, if there is discipline to do so, and thus the eye could become completely open, the witness. And this also describes what the third eye is...ever open witness.
Also at this power spot I pay attention to the behavior of people, they indicate what is happening in other areas and so the people serve as messengers in how they behave...what they say or do. Like actors sending forth spirits messages/teachings.I just answered this post and lost it accidentally.
Oh well, basically the principle you are talking about is in the story of Jacob/ Israel.
Jacob is the "supplanter" and "seeking after God"
His name changes to Israel "Grace or Favor with man and God."
Each time he has a spiritual experience his name changes to Israel.
Grace or Favor is a gift. It is not earned.
Jacob is called the "supplanter" (taking the place of another) because he tricks his brother Esau out of his inheritance and later tricks his father Isaac into giving him Esau's birthright also. This is well known.
But further, I believe that this supplanting taking place also has to do with Jacob taking the place of Israel.
This change of name happens several times. when he wrestles with an angel until the breaking of dawn (enlightenment). When he sees the ladder set up which I partially described above. And a very important instance where it actually says that Israel is Jacob's spirit which has been asleep, apparently.
Ge 45:26
And told him, saying, Joseph is yet alive, and he is governor over all the land of Egypt. And Jacob's heart fainted, for he believed them not.
Ge 45:27
And they told him all the words of Joseph, which he had said unto them: and when he saw the wagons which Joseph had sent to carry him, the spirit of Jacob their father revived:
Ge 45:28
And Israel said, It is enough; Joseph my son is yet alive: I will go and see him before I die.
Someone mentioned the coyote as trickster being the sorcerer's world or Astral planes. This sounds right to me. Jacob is a trickster. He is us.
We have a spiritual experience and turn it into an expanded part of our Tonal. We think we did it by our own effort.
But it is our desire to experience and know the unknown that brings us to these things.
Why are we different? Because we are Jacob. "Seeking after God." Seeking after the unknown.
But where did we get this yearning??? We, most of us were born with it, I think though maybe some got it later in life.
But most people could care less.
So the seeking after God (Jacob) that is a part of us is a gift (Israel) from God.
Don Juan said that Power dictated who would be an apprentice.
Jesus said, "You have not chosen me, but I have chosen you."
This awareness that it is all a gift, Grace, Favor, I believe helps us to keep the tonal from growing and taking over the spiritual side of things. Our world view expands but we know there is more to come.
Every time I've had what I consider a true Spiritual experience, (not just an astral level thing) it has been very different from anything I had experienced previously.
We are growing into the nagual as Don Juan might put it but growing in Christ in Christian terms. Fellow heirs, having recieved the birthright.
Going into a land we knew not.
"Surely the Lord is in this place and I knew it not."
"It has not entered into the hearts and minds of man what God has in store for his children."
It is beyond our ability to imagine.Yes, its a gradual thing isn't it. Like the right hand palm if we imagine its able to open it eyes with some exertion (maybe like when we are groggy with sleep), that feeling, so a bit of difficulty, but every time it opens its eyes, it becomes more like the left hand palm which is eternally open. God or Nagual. This is another way of saying its simply breaking that mirror of self-reflection that keeps one fixated on a self that is cut off from its environment to greater or lesser degrees. Power is the environment and also us. The reflection in the mirror is an illusion that drains focus and concentration onto trivial matters. Which may not seem trivial but using death as an adviser we see it is indeed trivial.
Such as the reflective process may tell us that an argument we just had was 'important' and the fact our view point was not heard was important. But if we were to then experience the wave of death upon us, the argument does not mean anything to us anymore and it never truly did (we may even wish to embrace that person one last time before we die, tell them we love them etc), only the mirror image held us in hypnotic suspension prior to realization of death. So then a person may ask, should ask..why am I engaging my energy in this futile way?
Here is the interesting part to me...once we see the futility of the argument, we may continue to engage with the person, except this time we do it with awakened awareness and intent (left hand). The other person may not know a shift occurred. It does not matter. Truth is, the world does not just stop being the way it is becasue we have an epiphany, in fact, we shift and thus we stop ourselves,simultaneously continuing on as if nothing different happened by external appearances, except that we seek to now harmonize with power around us (and with others) which will change our behavior away from its haphazard, careless states to instead focus new intent upon matters. It may not mean we apologize to the other person, in fact in some instances we may continue to stand our ground, sever ties even. SO, one cannot predict what those actions would be, as power adjusts continuously and thus has no fixed position. Power is simply an absence of self concern and thus acting accordingly to maintain the link with power. To enter into concern of self is to lose the link. So action is dictated by link alone and not any morals, cares, judgements that arise of mind/emotions.
Those who look for conclusions based on whats said and done will be mislead by what they conclude when encountering one who acts from power (only knowing intent informs here). A person with power has to live among fellow men this way being misunderstood, its called controlled folly. However, such a person linked to the nagual helps bring the light of awareness (power) into the environment by nature of what they intend and awareness they practice (expanded consciousness). I only mention this as its an added effect that comes along with power. One, as I see it, does not intend to save humanity, one simply seeks the nagual and to practice such awareness in ones acts to draw an even closer link. "Saving humanity, fellow humans" as a thought-concept is one of many mental deliberations (not of power).