03-20-2006, 12:00 AM
Nagual Lone Wolf
Yes ... well ... in the Siberian 'system' (to 'organize' awareness), these different parts or dimensions to our awareness are often called 'souls'.
Simplistically put the physical body-mind awareness is one soul, the dreaming-double/energy-body as another soul, the link to the Creator/Infinity as the third soul .... but when a person goes through a "Shamanic Death" experience, a person is said to have gained an additional soul (This additional soul is given to the person in initiation by the Thunderbird .... Grandfather Eagle).
The 'additional soul' could be described as an aware and active power-field of that link to Creator/Infinity, which from then on guides/rules the person's life, for his/her life no longer is his/her own anymore .... (not in ordinary sense of the word anyway).
i.e. a bit like that non-dual (third ?) attention had now become an actual power *entity* in a persons life. I suppose a bit like the difference between intuiting (nondual) third attention and acting from & with(in) the field of power of that (nondual) third attention.
I suppose this additional 'soul' could be likened to the term 'Nagual' ....
So are you Nagual Lone Wolf referring to this Nagual counterpart of a sorcerer as his/her double ?
Is a 'sorcerer' who acts from the field of power of third attention a *double being* ?
Zitter
Yes .... we really, really, really can say that we have got two bodies ....
Quote:We have the possibility to transfere our SELF into an energybody
Well .... yes ....
The organic body is your self, and the astral/dreaming body is your self also .... we do have multidimensional points of reference to our awareness, that we can shift and/or 'evolve' into.
But as I understand, we do need all of these dimensional reference points to our awareness in working order ..... to arrive to the so called "totality of ourselves"; - i.e. we do not become aware of other dimensions or worlds in exclusion of ordinary reality, but in addition to it.
These dimensional reference points all compliment one another .... within our 'totality'.
A bit like looking and seeing. Once we learn to see, we don't get rid of looking, but our perception gains different emphasis.
Ordinarily we look at things, taking everything for granted by automatically interpreting everything, but sometimes if things do not fit to our interpretations we afterwards try to think or make up or try to imagine what we had seen.
But if we had a (cultural) consensus emphasis put on seeing as t-h-e (real) way of perceiving things, we would learn to do things the other way round. We would see (sense/feel with our double or lets say energy-field) .... first ... and then look at the details which we had just seen/witnessed.
It seems that as we become aware in 'third attention' (?) .... our perception becoming a nondual 'witness'.... the two selves (the body-mind & the dreaming/energy-body) reference points to our existence become mere extensions or expressions or functions of that higher awareness reference point or 'higher order' .... which we now see & experience and identify with as more real ....
Bob May
Quote:When Elizabeth (John the Baptist's mother) saw Mary (the mother of Jesus) approaching, the Babe "Leapt in her womb", and she began to prophecy.
How interesting !
Yes, that sounds similar to the Aboriginal "Conception" I was talking about.
Thank you for writing about this.
Quote:
"A fearful experience (experienced when "stopping the World" when subjected to it after having been raised in Western culture. Takes some getting used to.
It would not be so (frightening that is) when raised to be aware of such things from birth".
Yes when experiencing 'altered states' it certainly does help to know that others have 'been there' before and experienced similar things, because the greatest threat is not the 'shift' itself, but that the mind cannot accept what is happening & starts to fight the situation .... thus 'soul loss' may result as the person becomes traumatised.
Once again I am not too sure, what is meant by "Stopping the World" ..... ?
Did read Castanedas books yeeeeers ago and they were a great inspiration, but of course one needs to intent/create ones own experiences from there.
Bright Flame ..... Could you please expand a bit more on your "Stopping the World" experience ... ?
Artnwere
Yes ... well ... in the Siberian 'system' (to 'organize' awareness), these different parts or dimensions to our awareness are often called 'souls'.
Simplistically put the physical body-mind awareness is one soul, the dreaming-double/energy-body as another soul, the link to the Creator/Infinity as the third soul .... but when a person goes through a "Shamanic Death" experience, a person is said to have gained an additional soul (This additional soul is given to the person in initiation by the Thunderbird .... Grandfather Eagle).
The 'additional soul' could be described as an aware and active power-field of that link to Creator/Infinity, which from then on guides/rules the person's life, for his/her life no longer is his/her own anymore .... (not in ordinary sense of the word anyway).
i.e. a bit like that non-dual (third ?) attention had now become an actual power *entity* in a persons life. I suppose a bit like the difference between intuiting (nondual) third attention and acting from & with(in) the field of power of that (nondual) third attention.
I suppose this additional 'soul' could be likened to the term 'Nagual' ....
So are you Nagual Lone Wolf referring to this Nagual counterpart of a sorcerer as his/her double ?
Is a 'sorcerer' who acts from the field of power of third attention a *double being* ?
Zitter
Yes .... we really, really, really can say that we have got two bodies ....
Quote:We have the possibility to transfere our SELF into an energybody
Well .... yes ....
The organic body is your self, and the astral/dreaming body is your self also .... we do have multidimensional points of reference to our awareness, that we can shift and/or 'evolve' into.
But as I understand, we do need all of these dimensional reference points to our awareness in working order ..... to arrive to the so called "totality of ourselves"; - i.e. we do not become aware of other dimensions or worlds in exclusion of ordinary reality, but in addition to it.
These dimensional reference points all compliment one another .... within our 'totality'.
A bit like looking and seeing. Once we learn to see, we don't get rid of looking, but our perception gains different emphasis.
Ordinarily we look at things, taking everything for granted by automatically interpreting everything, but sometimes if things do not fit to our interpretations we afterwards try to think or make up or try to imagine what we had seen.
But if we had a (cultural) consensus emphasis put on seeing as t-h-e (real) way of perceiving things, we would learn to do things the other way round. We would see (sense/feel with our double or lets say energy-field) .... first ... and then look at the details which we had just seen/witnessed.
It seems that as we become aware in 'third attention' (?) .... our perception becoming a nondual 'witness'.... the two selves (the body-mind & the dreaming/energy-body) reference points to our existence become mere extensions or expressions or functions of that higher awareness reference point or 'higher order' .... which we now see & experience and identify with as more real ....
Bob May
Quote:When Elizabeth (John the Baptist's mother) saw Mary (the mother of Jesus) approaching, the Babe "Leapt in her womb", and she began to prophecy.
How interesting !
Yes, that sounds similar to the Aboriginal "Conception" I was talking about.
Thank you for writing about this.
Quote:
"A fearful experience (experienced when "stopping the World" when subjected to it after having been raised in Western culture. Takes some getting used to.
It would not be so (frightening that is) when raised to be aware of such things from birth".
Yes when experiencing 'altered states' it certainly does help to know that others have 'been there' before and experienced similar things, because the greatest threat is not the 'shift' itself, but that the mind cannot accept what is happening & starts to fight the situation .... thus 'soul loss' may result as the person becomes traumatised.
Once again I am not too sure, what is meant by "Stopping the World" ..... ?
Did read Castanedas books yeeeeers ago and they were a great inspiration, but of course one needs to intent/create ones own experiences from there.
Bright Flame ..... Could you please expand a bit more on your "Stopping the World" experience ... ?
Artnwere