04-21-2011, 12:00 AM
CC had to be shown and enter into another world view in order to experience and understand that another world view was even possible. Don Juan told him early on that that new world view was just as illusory as the ordinary man's view.The trick was to slip between the two. Whether it is "between" or "beyond" is irrelevant in my opinion. It's all right here anyway. Bob May
But if you say “Its all right here anyway” and then say its “beyond” this can be a little confusing. That’s like saying its beyond “here”. But I do know what you are getting at Bob.
The other reason I wish to refrain from the word beyond in this regard is: For those that have spent years becoming familiar with the sorcerer’s view and practices, the sorcerer’s view and life is seen as an attainment beyond that of an average man. 2nd attention is often thought of as beyond 1st attention, the nagual beyond the tonal etc. This fosters the opinion that the sorcerer’s view is superior to that of an average man.
This sorcerer’s view is then further extrapolated. As we have heard countless times 3rd attention is considered something that is beyond 2nd attention in the manner that 2nd attention is beyond 1st attention. It is thought that 3rd attention is about transition to an energy body at the point of death or before. Now an average man is hardly going to be the one thinking about how to make this transition of awareness to an energy body and leave the planet or continue his awareness after death without relinquishing it. No that seems to be the exclusive consideration of a sorcerer. And I just wish to reiterate here that sorcerer’s old and new have been doing just that for centuries and it is only an accomplishment of 2nd attention. And as we know from DJ he does not consider this freedom or the totality of oneself as he says his predecessors did not attain this!
So for DJ at least there is a distinction between sorcery and what he is advocating. If one follows the practices of sorcerers only then the best you can hope for is the energy body option. But if you have gained just enough of that sorcerer’s view now and can clearly distinguish it from that of an average man there is another option but that other option is not the ultimate attainment of 2nd attention and its practices! It is not the next level after everything that can be achieved through sorcery and 2nd attention has been attained. It is not a reward for being a competent sorcerer. This option is available to “weasels” that see clearly these two views and opt for neither!
What is profound here is that not only is DJ a master at pitting these two views against each other with all the sobriety of a new seer but he also knows how to crack another’s bubble of perception so that the wings of perception will unfold and they can see their totality! Something apparently his predecessors did not know how to do.
I think “the blow that can’t parried” for the one that opens themselves to the sorcerers explanation is that for all those years after hearing about the sorcerer’s view one thought they were becoming a sorcerer by doing all those things prescribed by that view, at least Carlos did. And now it turns out according to DJ that was never the goal.
But if you say “Its all right here anyway” and then say its “beyond” this can be a little confusing. That’s like saying its beyond “here”. But I do know what you are getting at Bob.
The other reason I wish to refrain from the word beyond in this regard is: For those that have spent years becoming familiar with the sorcerer’s view and practices, the sorcerer’s view and life is seen as an attainment beyond that of an average man. 2nd attention is often thought of as beyond 1st attention, the nagual beyond the tonal etc. This fosters the opinion that the sorcerer’s view is superior to that of an average man.
This sorcerer’s view is then further extrapolated. As we have heard countless times 3rd attention is considered something that is beyond 2nd attention in the manner that 2nd attention is beyond 1st attention. It is thought that 3rd attention is about transition to an energy body at the point of death or before. Now an average man is hardly going to be the one thinking about how to make this transition of awareness to an energy body and leave the planet or continue his awareness after death without relinquishing it. No that seems to be the exclusive consideration of a sorcerer. And I just wish to reiterate here that sorcerer’s old and new have been doing just that for centuries and it is only an accomplishment of 2nd attention. And as we know from DJ he does not consider this freedom or the totality of oneself as he says his predecessors did not attain this!
So for DJ at least there is a distinction between sorcery and what he is advocating. If one follows the practices of sorcerers only then the best you can hope for is the energy body option. But if you have gained just enough of that sorcerer’s view now and can clearly distinguish it from that of an average man there is another option but that other option is not the ultimate attainment of 2nd attention and its practices! It is not the next level after everything that can be achieved through sorcery and 2nd attention has been attained. It is not a reward for being a competent sorcerer. This option is available to “weasels” that see clearly these two views and opt for neither!
What is profound here is that not only is DJ a master at pitting these two views against each other with all the sobriety of a new seer but he also knows how to crack another’s bubble of perception so that the wings of perception will unfold and they can see their totality! Something apparently his predecessors did not know how to do.
I think “the blow that can’t parried” for the one that opens themselves to the sorcerers explanation is that for all those years after hearing about the sorcerer’s view one thought they were becoming a sorcerer by doing all those things prescribed by that view, at least Carlos did. And now it turns out according to DJ that was never the goal.