04-26-2011, 12:00 AM
The “trick” was that Carlos thought he was becoming a sorcerer! I think we have all been tricked by DJ in this regard. We too thought he was teaching Carlos how to become a sorcerer and I dare say that some of us thought his teachings were teaching us how to do the same. This could be a tough pill to swallow. Lex
Depends on what you mean by a sorcerer's view and tricked. He had to experience the second attention.Early on in the books DJ said that a sorcerer was someone who had stopped the world. That was and is his definition of Sorcerer. Later he said that bringing Carlos into this strange environment with all of it's cultural aspects and out in the strange environment of the desert and the witches, etc., was to shake up his world. Bob
Yes, but it is you who is equating your “stopping the world” and what that means to “cracking the bubble of perception”. I am not. I think DJ uses the term sorcerer loosely much as he does with the term Eagle. At some point it became convenient to say sorcerer, yet all along it was part of his strategy. I have no doubts that CC experienced 2nd attention and experienced it very profoundly. And because his wings of perception unfolded 3rd attention too!
“Don’t take it so seriously,’ he said, laughing. “IT was very enjoyable for me to get into all that ****. and it was even more enjoyable because I knew that I was doing it for your benefit.”
“For my benefit, Don Juan? what kind of aberration is this?”
“Yes for your benefit. I tricked you by holding your attention on items of your world which held a profound fascination for you, and you swallowed it hook line and sinker. All I needed was to get your undivided attention. But how could I have done that when you had such an undisciplined spirit? You yourself told me time and time again that you stayed with me because you found what I said about the world fascinating. What you didn’t know how to express was that the fascination that you felt was based on the fact that you vaguely recognized every element I was talking about . You thought that the vagueness was, of course, shamanism, and you went for it meaning you stayed.” Wheel of Time.
What I think CC means by sorcerers' view, is the world of sorcery that DJ introduced him to, a world that seems preposterous to an average man.
Depends on what you mean by a sorcerer's view and tricked. He had to experience the second attention.Early on in the books DJ said that a sorcerer was someone who had stopped the world. That was and is his definition of Sorcerer. Later he said that bringing Carlos into this strange environment with all of it's cultural aspects and out in the strange environment of the desert and the witches, etc., was to shake up his world. Bob
Yes, but it is you who is equating your “stopping the world” and what that means to “cracking the bubble of perception”. I am not. I think DJ uses the term sorcerer loosely much as he does with the term Eagle. At some point it became convenient to say sorcerer, yet all along it was part of his strategy. I have no doubts that CC experienced 2nd attention and experienced it very profoundly. And because his wings of perception unfolded 3rd attention too!
“Don’t take it so seriously,’ he said, laughing. “IT was very enjoyable for me to get into all that ****. and it was even more enjoyable because I knew that I was doing it for your benefit.”
“For my benefit, Don Juan? what kind of aberration is this?”
“Yes for your benefit. I tricked you by holding your attention on items of your world which held a profound fascination for you, and you swallowed it hook line and sinker. All I needed was to get your undivided attention. But how could I have done that when you had such an undisciplined spirit? You yourself told me time and time again that you stayed with me because you found what I said about the world fascinating. What you didn’t know how to express was that the fascination that you felt was based on the fact that you vaguely recognized every element I was talking about . You thought that the vagueness was, of course, shamanism, and you went for it meaning you stayed.” Wheel of Time.
What I think CC means by sorcerers' view, is the world of sorcery that DJ introduced him to, a world that seems preposterous to an average man.