what is Time in Nagualism

[Mornings Son]

What is Time Nagualism and other that Nature science views?

[Blue totem]

Try to elaborate your question.


Your question is in what context?




As for your question, I don`t remember Don Juan teaching anything specific about time...

[Mornings Son]

What is the nature of time? Is it linear or not?

From wikipedia:


There is an appointed time (zman) for everything. And there is a time (’êth) for every event under heaven–

A time (’êth) to give birth, and a time to die; A time to plant, and a time to uproot what is planted.

A time to kill, and a time to heal; A time to tear down, and a time to build up.

A time to weep, and a time to laugh; A time to mourn, and a time to dance.

A time to throw stones, and a time to gather stones; A time to embrace, and a time to shun embracing.

A time to search, and a time to give up as lost; A time to keep, and a time to throw away.

A time to tear apart, and a time to sew together; A time to be silent, and a time to speak.

A time to love, and a time to hate; A time for war, and a time for peace. – Ecclesiastes 3:1–8


[edit] Linear and cyclical time
See also: Time Cycles and Wheel of time
In general, the Judaeo-Christian concept, based on the Bible, is that time is linear, with a beginning, the act of creation by God. The Christian view assumes also an end, the eschaton, expected to happen when Christ returns to earth in the Second Coming to judge the living and the dead. This will be the consummation of the world and time. St Augustine's City of God
was the first developed application of this concept to world history.
The Christian view is that God is uncreated and eternal so that He and
the supernatural world are outside time and exist in eternity.

Ancient cultures such as Incan, Mayan, Hopi, and other Native American Tribes, plus the Babylonian, Ancient Greek, Hindu, Buddhist, Jainist, and others have a concept of a wheel of time, that regards time as cyclical and quantic consisting of repeating ages that happen to every being of the Universe between birth and extinction.

[Blue totem]

Hello M-Son, If you wanna know about time, you could read up on basic quantum physics.


Maybe you will find writings from Einstein, on time and space.


As for your quotes... Personally, I avoid the bible in any case.




There is a saying in physics; ``nothing is created, nothing is lost.`` You can relate this to time... Why? Basically because the nature of matter is energy or
vibration. This energy is said to always have existed, and will always keep on existing. Matter keeps changing faces. Basic energy is recycled. But it is
always the same energy. Technically, energy does not age. So no real time. Only perpetual change.




``We are all made of stars``-Moby.


This is very true. The earth is a star that as cooled off, and our bodies are made of this material...


Basic energy, cycles, perpetual change. Very Buddhist...

[Bob May]

Mornings Son wrote:




What is the nature of time? Is it linear or not?


From wikipedia:






There is an appointed time (zman) for everything. And there is a time ('êth) for every event under heaven-
A time ('êth) to give birth, and a time to die; A time to plant, and a time to uproot what is planted.
A time to kill, and a time to heal; A time to tear down, and a time to build up.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh; A time to mourn, and a time to dance.
A time to throw stones, and a time to gather stones; A time to embrace, and a time to shun embracing.
A time to search, and a time to give up as lost; A time to keep, and a time to throw away.
A time to tear apart, and a time to sew together; A time to be silent, and a time to speak.
A time to love, and a time to hate; A time for war, and a time for peace. - Ecclesiastes 3:1-8
This can be looked at in a variety of ways. For instance; "..A time to be silent, and a time to speak. " We on this forum know the reason and benefits for keeping silent internally. Also how to speak or write to each other to comunicate what we experience.
Someone involved in ceremonial magic and or astrology may look more towards propitious times to perform certain acts. As many also involed with Wicca do.
Any way you read these verses in Ecclesiastes they are true.
What level are you reading it at and do you think that is all it says? That is the problem with religion. They read at one level and think that they have an understanding of the subject written about and any other ideas about that subject must be wrong.



[edit] Linear and cyclical time

See also: Time Cycles and Wheel of time
In general, the Judaeo-Christian concept, based on the Bible, is that time is linear, with a beginning, the act of creation by God. The Christian view assumes also an end, the eschaton, expected to happen when Christ returns to earth in the Second Coming to judge the living and the dead. This will be the consummation of the world and time. St Augustine's City of God was the first developed application of this concept to world history. The Christian view is that God is uncreated and eternal so that He and the supernatural world are outside time and exist in eternity.
What is outside of time cannot be described. Either by science or religion. To communicate concepts we have only words to make use of. The Bible starts with "In the Beginning" ( the second world, the world of "creation") science starts at what is created and goes "backwards" to the "Big Bang." Both descriptions stop at the beginning of time and space and matter.
The advantage that the Bible has is that it goes beyond this in telling us how we can Experience the Reality that lies beyond this boundary. Just because something cannot be described does not mean we cannot experience it firsthand.
Ancient cultures such as Incan, Mayan, Hopi, and other Native American Tribes, plus the Babylonian, Ancient Greek, Hindu, Buddhist, Jainist, and others have a concept of a wheel of time, that regards time as cyclical and quantic consisting of repeating ages that happen to every being of the Universe between birth and extinction.
               Cycles are also covered in the Bible. Spirals may be more accurate though. Even though the world spins on it's axis and revovles around the sun and the sun travels a circular path etc., when one circle or cycle is complete, nothing is where it was when the circle or cycle began. So this would necessarily dictate a spiral motion as opposed to a circle. So, though everything follows a curve, it also has a forward motion.
You only have to look at nature to see the spiral pattern in plants and shells.

[Blue totem]

If there is no aging to speak of, then there is no time. It seems there is only a perpetual present. Very zen buddhist.


The universe has not aged a bit. Energy does not age, it moves, but its nature stays the same eternally.




Yes, I would say time is linear in general, because changes in that energy, events, have beginnings and ends that you can mesure.


But time is something that can elude the scientific mind, in some cases its not linear. Rules dont stick to time.




Somehow, past, present and future can be confused in one big category. Mediums are good exemples of that...


Time and space are things methaphysical, hard to quantify or define, they are paradoxes.

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Time is this moment then it is gone. Gone to where is nothing and substance that is non-existent. Time is here and there and nothing.

[Mornings Son]

The reason I bing the subject up is because of a dream where I meditate and the look up and see through time. Everytime I recall this I see myself looking at
me through time.




I use to agree with wolf on the "here and now glimps of time#, but now I know there is something more to it.


Infinity is beyond humanform and mind.


Is past, present and future one?


I recall some indian time concept that was completely different from our. It was something in the language, like 'to city I come' means 'I will go
to the city'


The aboriginals have the dreamtime.. from wikipedia:


Fred Alan Wolf opens chapter nine of The Dreaming Universe (1994) entitled The Dreamtime with a quote from The Last Wave, a film by Peter Weir:




Aboriginals believe in two forms of time; two parallel streams of activity. One is the daily objective activity, the other is an infinite spiritual cycle
called the "dreamtime", more real than reality itself. Whatever happens in the dreamtime establishes the values, symbols, and laws of Aboriginal
society. It was believed that some people of unusual spiritual powers had contact with the dreamtime.




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreamtime

[Blue totem]

Dreamtime is typical of many aboriginal cultures.




I remember my readings on Australian aboriginals...

[rosygyro]

time is a force that is percieved in parrallel to something as grows(like a tree for instance)..


time in parralel to life is nature...


time percieved at angles to is termed logic! or lack of control!




should the universe evr contain so much life that it is full.. there will be no space left... and life will change form and direction in order to still move
and move in parralell to a different form o life rythm.. denoting time in a different sense!.. space will become change....... meaning what we term space
now... not only has the potential not to be.... but can also be deemed a precursor to a different form of evolving awareness! it may already be full.. we just
may be like bullets in water.. as far as space is.....




wow this is compete garbage... I have to post it on principle now ive written it!... oops!




s

[Nagual LoneWolf]

time is time and it rules us.

[VoiceMorph]

btw the third thread was from theother forum




and time not rules, not gives rules, not accepts rules, not wants rules

[VoiceMorph]

haven't seen there was a first page before


welcome other people, you use lots of words, but i see you want to understand


sorry i read only short text

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Rules ..explain Voicemorph.

[rosygyro]

I love waxing lyrical as well you know!




Time does not rule a tree.. life does


we as a people are ruled by social conditioning, which is damage caused by the perception of "time".


if life moves in an arc.... time juts out in points from its edge marking its progress.. causing damage to all who aspire to understand it!


but it is logic this idea of time...true thought is found within the arc...as is timelessness! ....


these ticks and tocks... stem from life... but the logical mind creates nuclear warheads, and carbon engines....that will oneday ruin the foundation, that even
makes time possible!...


time will be extinct the day the last man drops dead!... life will move unhindered... until another monkey starts to think!

[Guest]