What is your feeling concerning the Foreign Installation?

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Do you believe in the foreign installation? That it controls your thoughts. Feeds on your energy?

[Guest]

Well I was reading over this, interesting thread. The question popped in my mind, What created the foreign installation? Did we create it in some way? I know ive seen mentioned it being aligned to the Jungian collective unconscious. But anyway, what in essense made the thing?

[Nagual LoneWolf]

As far as has been studied, the fi was here before the creation of mankind. In the garden of eden was the fi let loose to prey upon us.

[Guest]

So are you saying the FI is like the devil?

[Nagual LoneWolf]

I believe once the veil was lifted we became open to the flyers.

[Guest]

Nagual LoneWolf wrote:
I believe once the veil was lifted we became open to the flyers.
The veil was lifted? Or was it pulled over our eyes?

[Nagual LoneWolf]

I know you know the answer but the answer is yes and yes.

[Guest]

Nagual LoneWolf wrote:
I know you know the answer but the answer is yes and yes.
I know *smiles* The reason is, there are many veils. Its all maya now, as the Hindus say. I guess Im just used to the expression of piercing the veil, when we try to get a glimmer of what is real, behind the scene of the dream, that 'presents' itself as (consentual) reality.
Course at the astral too, Ive encountered beings that seemed to try to stand in the way of progress. I have yet to determine if they are agents of sort that really try to stand in the way, or if they're to test who's worthy or not. Im not sure. I just try to take it all in stride, keep my eyes on the infinite.

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Being worthy is a task on task affair Infinity watcher.

[Guest]

Nagual LoneWolf wrote:
Being worthy is a task on task affair Infinity watcher.I know, seems to be the case. Both in the tonal and the nagual world, every act counts. Im working on trying to purify my heart so this lifetime *gestures spirit* Im seen as worthy. Im willing to do what it takes to get there.

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Whatever it takes? (evil laugh!).

[Guest]

Nagual LoneWolf wrote:
Whatever it takes? (evil laugh!).*smiles* Within reason Nagual Lonewolf. Within reason

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Within reason is actually a answer that defies answering, for what really is within reason in this universe of ours? You do not have to answer but reason is never reason enough..

[Guest]

Nagual LoneWolf wrote:
Within reason is actually a answer that defies answering, for what really is within reason in this universe of ours? You do not have to answer but reason is never reason enough..Well what I mean is, Im willing to put in the effort, and do what it takes to succeed, but I wouldnt do anything that would only jeopardize my karma, like harm another to get to where I want to go. I want more good dharma than bad karma

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Ah karma..the karma question. I have good karma some say..

[Guest]

Nagual LoneWolf wrote:
Ah karma..the karma question. I have good karma some say..
I'm sure you do...

[Nagual LoneWolf]

If there is karma one can build it up by doing good deeds yes? Thus there would be somehow a container for the karma, energetic and thus we would have to carry it with us and where with us, well inside us much like power I might allude to.

[Guest]

Well good deeds and Karma are tricky. I think that, if someone is doing good deeds soley cause they want good karma, while its ok, it still is sort of selfish if the only are doing good deeds because they want something for themself. Now, I think they can still create good karma for themselves anyway, cause they're still doing a good deed. But its when someone is doing it more from a pure heart because they have compassion for another, when it really makes a different. And we see examples of this all the time. I remember reading about this woman who spent her years cleaning, and saved up $100,000. She donated it to a scholarship fund so students could go to college. Now, to me she did it because she really cared, and wanted to see other kids go to school, maybe so they wouldnt have to do work like her. Such acts I believe dont go unnoticed, and we will have times where Spirit will test us, and we can act on it, but we still must do it in an unselfish way.
But at the same time of course, we all want good karma, and it can be a good motivator to do good. I think Spirit knows it

[Guest]

Well over the last few days Ive been reading this section concerning the FI. I read the quotes by DJ though read the Active Side of Infinity (I have the book), and asked my teacher as well, if there was an FI. He didnt define it as an entity but he said its our identity. And that he didnt know of anyone but himself who has freed himself of the FI. This seems to be in alignment with what Ruiz says is the dream of hell on the planet. So Ive been meditating on this issue, trying to give an assessment.
I dont see the FI as an entity, as in, a living breathing, sentient being. However, when I explore this, I see the FI as a 'thing' created over many years, since mankind was mankind, created whenever the creation of duality formed. It became a thing which many were 'plugged into,' which is related to being conditioned, and whereas many will go with the consensus on certain things. For example, lots of people eat at McDonalds. Its not good for you, but advertisers are probably familiar with the nature of people, and they know how to reach them with clever advertising, and making things convenient. How did you become accustomed to liking french fries with ketchup, was it really your tastes, or did the FI give you this habit? Do you like a beer after work? Is it really you which began to like the taste of beer, or was it the FI? What causes you to go to Starbucks and spend $5.00 on a cup of coffee, when you can buy a whole can for the price, and make several cups at home? Little things like that, cause the mind is very susceptible to its addictions...
Do you like action movies with lots of violence, or horror movies which make you scared? The original mind abhors violence, knows its wrong, and wants nothing to do with it. But the FI hooks people into spending money, feeding the FI back, by providing such movies and programs. What makes people become addicted to pornography? All these things sneak up subtly, but eventually 'many' people are drawn into such things. And then, they demand more of it. And they're not free, because the true nature of mind isnt influenced by such things and wants nothing to do with them.
A way to defeat the FI and become a free warrior is to reject what 'everyone does,' and by finding what you like verses what everyone likes and everyone does. Switching gears and watching family movies, reading books that are full of wisdom, and of course doing things like meditation, taking long walks. Getting close to nature. Sitting by a river, watching it flow. The FI doesn't like to be bored, doesn't like a quiet mind. It has nothing to latch onto when all is quiet and clear. It doesn't like wisdom because it needs people to be ignorant for it to exist.
What beliefs do you have which are your own, vs what people have told you? Question your beliefs. Explore them. Try to directly experience what you know. This may sound more agnostic, but still the approach makes sense. Toss it into the abyss and see what comes back up.
I know many think there are flyers and parasites (same thing) but what I believe is such things per the FI come across in such ways. Mind can be very powerful, and create thoughtforms which come across as entities, parasites, IBs and all sorts of things. Such things exist at the lower astral, and through dreaming one can explore their 'house of mind' and conquer those odd things that live there. Have you ever had a dream where you entered a house which was dusty and filthy? The call then is on to clean the house of mind and make it livable. This takes a ruthlessness of being a warrior, and going to war with all that resides so you can take back your mind and make it your own. Like the zen buddhists say, get back to original mind.
Im under the impression that regardless to the power of the FI and the 'many' which fuel it, that individually it only has so much power over you, if you give your power away to it. One must take back their power and make it their own. You may have to spend a lifetime ridding yourself of such things, and the thought can be overwhelming and exhausting. However, if you take it a day at a time, then you can win a battle here and there, and free yourself of the FI more and more. You may find in certain moments you are very bored when you do, when all is quiet. But it is a signal if you're bored, that you are having a free moment, so grasp it.
 
Anyway just some of my thoughts on it. Two cents.

[Mornings Son]

good karma ends

evil karma ends

Why not be free of karma completely?

[Guest]

Mornings Son wrote:
good karma ends
evil karma ends
Why not be free of karma completely?Well eventually that is the goal.

[Guest]