We'll see

[seeitall]

There was a little boy. And this boy, at his 14th birthday, gets a horse. And everybody in the village says, "how wonderful, the boy got a horse!"
The Zen master says, "we'll see."




Two years later, the boy falls off the horse, breaks his leg and the whole village says, "how terrible!" The Zen master says, "we'll
see."




Then a war breaks out and all the young men have to go out and fight, except that this boy can't, because his leg is all messed up, so now everybody in the
village says, "how wonderful!"




And the Zen master says 'We'll see.'

[ARNWAY]

Hello Seeitall I will always consider you a friend but how is anyone going to post a response to this especially me to this?




My question is that I would ask the Zen master this - "What the *** are you refering to when he says- 'We'll see.'? - What's
your response Seeitall?

[seeitall]

maybe someone else will find this story useful as I did. works geat for me to ease the FI influence.


as for your question, I have no f*g idea what you are asking about.

[ARNWAY]

Just consider that you are the Zen master.




Under no circumstance do not rely on anyone to tell you what to think.

[Bob Carr]

In Christian belief, this means , simply, that negative events may lead to positive outcomes, or vice-versa.


I am rather linear, and I find it hard to accept tho I must admit it is probably true.


Seeitall, I actually prefer your example. Makes it easier.

[glance left]

Arnway,




Seeitall gives an excellent analogy of the FI, which is obsessed with polarity...this and that, wrong and right, blessing and curse...bing, bong...bing,
bong...bing, bong on and on forever. The Zen Master in the story understands this and indirectly points it out to the people he is trying to instruct. Don Juan
said the same when he talked about "average man" seeing events in his life as either a blessing or a curse...in comparison to the warrior who sees
events as neither...simply inexorable challenges.

[Vrill]

Here's another one ...



A beautiful girl in the village was pregnant. Her angry parents demanded to know who was the father. At first
resistant to confess, the anxious and embarrassed girl finally pointed to Hakuin, the Zen master whom everyone previously revered for living such a pure life.




When the outraged parents confronted Hakuin with their daughter's accusation, he simply replied "Is that so?"




When the child was born, the parents brought it to the Hakuin, who now was viewed as a pariah by the whole village. They demanded that he take care of the
child since it was his responsibility. "Is that so?"




Hakuin said calmly as he accepted the child. For many months he took very good care of the child until the daughter could no longer withstand the lie she had
told. She confessed that the real father was a young man in the village whom she had tried to protect.




The parents immediately went to Hakuin to see if he would return the baby. With profuse apologies they explained what had happened.




"Is that so?" Hakuin said as he handed them the child.






The Zen master demonstrates his equanimity and abiding calm. How many of us have even a grain of that presence or can discern the value of it?

[glance left]

I have a grain.....a single seed. It is planted in the circumstances that surround me, little by little. I'm seeing the green shoots even now, pushing
through the crust of the soil that's protected it for years and years, extending into the moment that inexorably blooms in front of me.




A single grain....it's enough to begin.

[ARNWAY]

I don't want to come across as knowing everything but I have stopped the world and perceived outside of the F.I. but this perception is only for a short
time unless you have the energy to escape it forever which most likely be a life time and when I mention something it is not just something I read about.




I have reached the second attention numerous times and when I do I know what I have to do in my life to continue this precious awareness by cleaning my tonal
(and its not the best) but enough to catch a glimpse of what can be attained by shifting your awareness outside the realm of the fliers.




Something that I keep recommending to achieve this is to take little smoke if you know what I mean and what I found is that most people are afraid only because
the F.E. inside them tells them that it is bad but what it does is makes them leave so you can think with your true perception.




When I have done this I enter into my energy body and merge with energy emanations with full control and merge with threads of light even while I'm around
several people around a camp fire talking to friends and within a few seconds I would enter into several journeys and nobody would notice anything out of the
ordinary.

[ARNWAY]

Most of what I talk about is from experiences in the second attention and I can not elaborate enough that members need to find away to attain the second
attention some way or another and our time is limited.

[ARNWAY]

Glance I have always had respect for you so don't take my inquiry as a threat but have you ever stopped the world?




Do you dream with total control of your volition while in a dream instead of having it being as if watching a movie?




Have you reach the second attention while awake and venture with your energy body and still function with people around?




Just curious to ask.

[glance left]

Arnway, I've seen and experienced some incredible things, as have you I'm sure.




I've seen the world of objects turn to wispy vapor right before my very eyes and felt my awareness spread like warm oil throughout its construct, feeling
every movement of everything around me as if it were happening within my own body....the corpus of my being. I've seen the world resolve into the most
unfathomable display of feathery fractal-ated fibrous colored light and traversed and "played" amongst this incomprehensible sea of awareness and
brought back silent knowledge like a trophy. I've done war with shadow beings who followed my fear right back into my bedroom in the waking world and
subdued them with a stroke of courage..with unlikely laughter in the face of exquisite fear. I've been to other planets, changed into other creatures both
winged and clawed, interacted with a myriad of shining beings, been tempted and offered power by flesh-eaters, been ministered to by the Witches and Carlos
Castaneda and don Juan, and Lujan, on and on and on...all in complete lucidity and consciousness.




But honestly Aranno, who gives a ****?




If I've experienced all of this but don't have the elegance and sobriety to bring humility and a sense of service to the world of people that surrounds
me every day in the first attention, then all of these experiences become a profound waste of time. I'd be better off experiencing none of these exotic
states and simply learn to dissolve my self-importance while in the first attention than to become an arrogant earl in the second attention.




We'd best learn the lesson of the first attention while we still have it available to us. It is a gift....a rare state that offers incredible possibilities
for evolution of our spirit.

[ARNWAY]

Glance you have your path and I have mine the difference between me and you is that I choose my actions from the second attention and your description of your
"earl" is all you.


Even though you have experienced your wondrous experiences and I'm proud of you to do this but I can go back to the same assemblage point of perception
with total continuity to continue where I left off from my and remember everything that transpired of my warrior journey.




I can re-dream and recap at will to get my energy back


of any dream that concerns me.




The point is is that when I hear members talking about these fairy tale dreams means nothing to me unless you can "SEE" energy.




I consider myself a seer do you.




I ask this because you act like an authority.




Glance do you consider yourself a seer?

[glance left]

Of course I do, Arnway. You are surrounded by seers....did you know this? But, alas, you consider yourself a "seer of distinction", that much is
obvious. Your arrogance is unimpeachable, apparently. You are like those martial arts experts who become enamored with their own physical skill yet miss the
boat regarding the massive range of discipline that extends far beyond the pittance that is encapsulated by combat maneuvers...maneuvers which were meant to be
subterfuge to begin with....symbolic of an inner combat...inner warfare against an unseen opponent.




I'll leave you to your kingdom. Enjoy your "reign" while it lasts.

[ARNWAY]

Quote from Glance>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Of course I do, Arnway. You are surrounded by seers....did you know this? But, alas, you consider yourself a "seer of distinction", that much is
obvious. Your arrogance is unimpeachable, apparently. You are like those martial arts experts who become enamored with their own physical skill yet miss the
boat regarding the massive range of discipline that extends far beyond the pittance that is encapsulated by combat maneuvers...maneuvers which were meant to
be subterfuge to begin with....symbolic of an inner combat...inner warfare against an unseen opponent.




I'll leave you to your kingdom. Enjoy your "reign" while it lasts. >-------------------------------------






Glance give me a list of dreamers or seers that choose there dreams at will and have the option to shut off there internal dialog and intend to see the energy
configuration of what is in there dream.




I'm not saying I'm the only one but I have not encountered very many like me that that can do this Glance.




Most members of any site will post dreams and consider them to be important but they lack the control to act with volition of there will and you know what
I'm talking about and the list of dreamers is very small.




What the hell Glance I will go so far as me being the best dreamer lately on the web of C.C. websites.




I will provide my dreaming log and challenge you to show me where someone has the control.




I don't want to say that I'm the best but most people do not have the control like I do even your nagual Lujan because I could easily illustrate that I
have more personal control than he does with my dreaming body.

[ARNWAY]

Glance we are not surrounded by seers to the point that you talk about and please tell me what it takes to be a seer and from your statement what do you
consider someone to become a seer.




What ability does it take for someone to become a seer?




Glance since you opened your mouth give me a list of who is a seer.




Glance give me the elements required to be considered as a seer.




Glance do you consider yourself a seer?

[glance left]

"Glance since you opened your mouth"




I am realizing now that I have made an error in coming here. Suffice it to say that my own compulsion for argument has embroiled me once again....another
lesson learned the hard way.




I will say this. Your community has done you a grave disservice, Aranno. You are being enabled. This constant braggadocio should have been reigned in eons ago.






I will withdraw now......this mouth is closed.

[ARNWAY]

Well Glance I just stalked you and you fell to your knees really quick because you are mostly talk and truly not a seer, other wise you would not run away.




The reason why I stalked Lujan- aka Asian(Lujan) and questioned him on his intent is because he wants to take control of the Carlos Castaneda websites when he
reflects something different.




I will take the pleasure to point this out because he does not reflect Toltec knowledge that Don Juan Matus talked about from Carlos and Lujan (akaAsian Lujan)
wanted to twist it into his Asian version with his Dragon tears bullshit that should not be associated with a true C.C. website.




The problem is that he wanted to merge with Wolf's site and this would ultimately discredit the integrity of the teachings of Don Juan Matus written by
Carlos.




Lujan (aka Asian) imposed his bullshit and started all this and I will put an end to it.




Glance so you might want to go back to P.P. site and worship your new Asian so called nagual (Asian Lujan) and have him tell you what to think and interpret
the world.

[glance left]

LOL...nobody's on their knees, Arannolito. So you can wipe that smug look off your face.




I'll leave with this final word, spoken to the rest of the community here.




Seeing is a breeze. Aranno makes it out to be something reserved for the elite, namely himself, because he's desperate to protect his perceived position of
dominance. The truth is, everyone sees...all the time. We simply need to remove a veil that is so thin it's practically made of gossamer. The veil, of
course, is the internal dialog. And the hardest part to seeing is vanquishing the internal dialog. Once internal silence has gathered momentum, one can
apprehend a certain thrumming feeling that seems to be associated with the physical body but really is loosely associated...this is the energy body. This
feeling is the true source of "seeing"....in that the seeing becomes a function of the feeling...i.e. we give visual representation to what we are
feeling in our energy bodies. It's probably easiest to do this initially behind closed lids...or by gazing with the soft gaze at a blank wall while
cultivating and sustaining this silence. As this vibrational feeling blooms, one might begin to see a scintillating blotch of color form either behind closed
lids or, if one likes, on the blank wall. It is a very delicate state to uphold this perception of this scintillating blotch without resorting to internal talk
about it....it's delicate, but then again, its the simplest thing in the world. It's important to tell ourselves this.....this is a NATURAL state that
anyone can lay hold of. Really, the rest of the procedure is academic. The key is to let the feeling that is represented by the blotch of scintillating color
to unfold while sustaining inner silence. The vibrational feeling will naturally bloom...as will its visual representation. At first fleeting images will
become available which may soon develop into full blown dream scenes which can be quite mind boggling, I'll be the first to attest. Some hear sounds or see
words appear...often incomprehensible at first but then developing clarity over time. One thing that is important to notice is that if dream scenes do emerge
from the abstract scintillating light, one can resolve the dream scene back into it's essential abstraction. If one can do this with a deep sense of
release....letting go of the "import" of what one is seeing in the dream vignette...then one can see the energy behind the dream directly. This is
easiest, probably, to approach from within a dream scene...or while a dream scene is just starting to form. Once this is accomplished, it's important to
realize that the waking state...our daily consciousness...is a dream scene as well, albeit a very stable one. It is possible to, in the same way, release this
dream and see the abstract state that supports it.




Again, there is a part of us already doing this all the time, as Carlos Castaneda has mentioned on several occasions. We need to know that it is very close,
regardless of how far away it seems. We are so close to the source of our freedom, it's a fucking shame we're led to believe otherwise. All of those
convoluted dreaming techniques and ritual methods and associations were made by men who were obsessed with control. Don Juan alluded to this many times.

[Bob May]

Good post Glance.

[seeitall]

glance left wrote:

"Glance since you opened your mouth"




I am realizing now that I have made an error in coming here. Suffice it to say that my own compulsion for argument has embroiled me once again....another
lesson learned the hard way.




I will say this. Your community has done you a grave disservice, Aranno. You are being enabled. This constant braggadocio should have been reigned in eons
ago.






I will withdraw now......this mouth is closed.




In ASI d.j. says that the hardest thing is to leave people alone (meaning not trying to change them or "help them").


If despite the warning you cannot resist the temptation,




you should not be disappointed or surprised by the result.


SR is not penitentiary , or at least I hope so.

I like your comment about seeing too.

[glance left]

Seeitall,




Word!




(((Bob May)))

[Guest]

seeitall


You see Glance hasn't really done anything wrong here. And neither have you.




It's just that these words or his words or your words didn't have the desired result or impact required to alter


Aranno's perception.




I spoke with Wolf on one occasion about a journey that I undertook where I visited Aranno in the second attention. He didn't have the power to wake up. He
didn't even know I was there. He was groggy, as a normal person would be. He is not what he says he is.




I waited only for the appropriate time that power allotted for my energy body to be there.




There was no symbiosis so I went elsewhere.




The reason that he screams and tantrums is that he does not possess the very items he says he has under control.





So all in all when one gives of their time that is their power, spent, it is a requirement of power the one awakens to the spending of that. And if they cannot
then they do not possess power in the first place.




And under this premise Aranno should be seen as he is; a broken gourd that is continually groping at what his attention cannot grasp via the gaping crack that
leaks the very power that he needs to possess to even comprehend that it is broken.




I can see what you all are trying to achieve. Yet your achievements have the tenency to turn the words of others into the trap that you deem worthy via your
syntax. And this is not what it's about. It's about something else. And if you can't see that then so be it.




The Tenant once said to another - 'can you see your eyebrow?' Then he said, 'even if you find it in the mirror, what you will discover is only
your self reflection'.

[mollymarie]

I spoke with Wolf on one occasion about a journey that I undertook where I visited Aranno in the second attention. He didn't have the power to wake up.
He didn't even know I was there. He was groggy, as a normal person would be. He is not what he says he is.




I waited only for the appropriate time that power allotted for my energy body to be there.




There was no symbiosis so I went elsewhere.




The reason that he screams and tantrums is that he does not possess the very items he says he has under control.




So all in all when one gives of their time that is their power, spent, it is a requirement of power the one awakens to the spending of that. And if they
cannot then they do not possess power in the first place.




And under this premise Aranno should be seen as he is; a broken gourd that is continually groping at what his attention cannot grasp via the gaping crack
that leaks the very power that he needs to possess to even comprehend that it is broken.
lol....ah...and the retaliation. No really, Im more powerful than he is! And here is why!


Come off it guys....


This ego **** isnt where you need to be at...


shiat I should have just copied my post to arrano, here in this thread, because the same gist applies to you lujan. If you are better than him, why do you
need to tell others about it? Why do you need to be here defending yourself? Just let it go and move on.

[Vrill]

glance left wrote:

I have a grain.....a single seed. It is planted in the circumstances that surround me, little by little. I'm seeing the green shoots even now, pushing
through the crust of the soil that's protected it for years and years, extending into the moment that inexorably blooms in front of me.




A single grain....it's enough to begin.

Yes, a grain of Truth is enough!
But, try putting yourself in Hakuin's place, then read the story again and ask how would I react?




Not that Hakuin is right or wrong. "is that so?" is the not the right or wrong thing to say, but would the same circumstances throw you off your
spot?