06-09-2011, 12:01 AM
”LoneWolf” wrote:Not having ones ap fixed is the first challenge but it does have some drawbacks when the foreign installation influences the movements.
Not having a fixed AP… Yes, but there has to be some other element involved for it to be good. Not sure what this element is, wondering if it could not be called sobriety, or just some form of control, or hm awareness of it happening, so that one can also ‘unhappen’ it, if needed.
Because I remember from my earlier days, when I could not control the AP movement as I can now (and even now it basically depends how hard or easy or natural it is to get to a position) that at that time it was often quite uncomfortable. It would shift somewhere and for some moment, day even, I would be impacted. Many times it was magical, made the moment magical, but often it would get in my way if I wanted to focus on something else. To have a somewhat looser AP, in this sense, and not being able to fix it where you wish, to jump to somewhere else with both feet and ground yourself on the ground there… well if one cannot, then I would not see it as such a practical thing.
I remember there was a time when I was in a somewhat in-between state, not being able to bring myself wholly into a required situation. This might not just have to do with fixing the AP, but also with some kind of feel for oneself, what all one needs to take to the desired spot (in order to feel one is completely there). Because as I started to get a better feel and understanding of myself it got better.
I would go with the idea that I had difficulty to move to the other position and stayed in some in betweenness not because of a lack of fluidity, but because of a lack of control and because of an inability to fully move to the desired spot. And that I did not know how to ground myself in that new spot and kept "flying off". Because if I got to a spot naturally then I was complete, but if I wanted to change it somewhere on my own it was very hard.
I am actually quite sensitive to when the AP starts to wiggle, I feel it often for example when I am ill and with this I often know if an illness is coming. But it also happens in other type of situations. Maybe this is not precisely the AP what I am talking about here (if we take AP to be outside the physical body, I never really looked into where exactly it is, I just remember that the blow DJ was giving to CC to dislocate his AP was not a real physical blow), because I feel it physically (although I could also say it goes both ways), but somehow I see it connected, because then I change focus. And it also makes sense that the AP would be a bit looser when we are ill, at those times it is known changing levels of perception is very easy.
”Nu Lang” wrote: And so as sorcerers we can shift and thus choose, where as non sorcerers would not be likely aware of this option. Being a sorcerer doing this, its important to curtail self importance (this would rid of judgements you mentioned about)lest the shifts be influenced by the foreign installation. The ap can be compared to different parts on earth, some locations we would not want to visit.
Nice linking suspending judgment with preventing shifts influenced by the FI (I am turning this around again). Yes, I could see a range where that applies; I am thinking if that is all it takes to prevent it. Somehow seems too easy . This surely is true, partially, and then there is another part. A different way that the FI can do this, some other lever that it can use. Thinking what it might be… hm are preconceptions basically judgments? They indeed are, just that we are less aware of them, because a lot of them got learned with the whole matrix. Interesting… And of course, there are other forms of self importance than just the thinking that one knows it all and can judge it all. But it is a good link that getting rid of self importance would rid us of judgments, wonder if it would rid us of preconceptions as well, how do you see this?
”Nu Lang” wrote:"Sometimes the collective AP might not be desirable, but if a sorcerer needs to do it, then how does he get out, provided he is impeccable and merges with all his being with that AP?"
Its our individuality and its link with the nagual (these two combined become personal power) that is this cooperative navigational system. That means we are always aware of the nature of awareness itself and its interplay of individual and collective upon us and others. So if a sorcerer is practicing controlled folly, which is what I think you were referring to above, and merges with a collective position, you asked how does he get out of that merging. My answer would be that he never completely merged, only enough to express the sentiment of that position, however his personal power kept him free from annihilation (of his sorcerer awareness) into that collective.
I agree, controlled folly creates this kind of space in between. Between the nothing and the mask. In this space we have the knowledge (somewhere) and intent that it is a mask and this pulls us out. So yes, in this sense one would never completely merge, even if it is looking as any other person. Maybe it is helpful to introduce the notion of personal and impersonal here, as Nu Lang did. That the personal shifts to hold the AP, but the more impersonal keeps the overall stuff, intent, and helps pull us back.
Here I would tie back to what I said before:
I wrote: I think this is where we have to have the pull from the other side so to speak. I think this triggers a sort of remembering, which brings us out of the state. I am not sure if I can call this pull will, it might be, would make sense, but … I am inclined to call [it] the pull of my self, or something to that effect .
So now I have an answer to where more exactly this pull comes from.
This led me to another interesting thought. If even as we are now (most of us) ignorant to our true potential and no self being, if it is not about realizing this space of nothingness in between. This space that we slowly start to make use of, but maybe the biggest feat is to really go there, or be there.
Is that the void? Hm possibly not, I thought this pull is what gets one out of there back into the me, so it would not make sense . Maybe from that space we are closer to the void, maybe from there we can peek into the unknown.
I am most possibly mixing things here that should not be mixed.. but I got a bit exited for a second as these thoughts emerged in me while I was writing my reply. Still I know the mind is not enough to figure stuff out, so I am just leaving this here hanging a bit (because I am not sure I can digest all this now to make sense of it).
Not having a fixed AP… Yes, but there has to be some other element involved for it to be good. Not sure what this element is, wondering if it could not be called sobriety, or just some form of control, or hm awareness of it happening, so that one can also ‘unhappen’ it, if needed.
Because I remember from my earlier days, when I could not control the AP movement as I can now (and even now it basically depends how hard or easy or natural it is to get to a position) that at that time it was often quite uncomfortable. It would shift somewhere and for some moment, day even, I would be impacted. Many times it was magical, made the moment magical, but often it would get in my way if I wanted to focus on something else. To have a somewhat looser AP, in this sense, and not being able to fix it where you wish, to jump to somewhere else with both feet and ground yourself on the ground there… well if one cannot, then I would not see it as such a practical thing.
I remember there was a time when I was in a somewhat in-between state, not being able to bring myself wholly into a required situation. This might not just have to do with fixing the AP, but also with some kind of feel for oneself, what all one needs to take to the desired spot (in order to feel one is completely there). Because as I started to get a better feel and understanding of myself it got better.
I would go with the idea that I had difficulty to move to the other position and stayed in some in betweenness not because of a lack of fluidity, but because of a lack of control and because of an inability to fully move to the desired spot. And that I did not know how to ground myself in that new spot and kept "flying off". Because if I got to a spot naturally then I was complete, but if I wanted to change it somewhere on my own it was very hard.
I am actually quite sensitive to when the AP starts to wiggle, I feel it often for example when I am ill and with this I often know if an illness is coming. But it also happens in other type of situations. Maybe this is not precisely the AP what I am talking about here (if we take AP to be outside the physical body, I never really looked into where exactly it is, I just remember that the blow DJ was giving to CC to dislocate his AP was not a real physical blow), because I feel it physically (although I could also say it goes both ways), but somehow I see it connected, because then I change focus. And it also makes sense that the AP would be a bit looser when we are ill, at those times it is known changing levels of perception is very easy.
”Nu Lang” wrote: And so as sorcerers we can shift and thus choose, where as non sorcerers would not be likely aware of this option. Being a sorcerer doing this, its important to curtail self importance (this would rid of judgements you mentioned about)lest the shifts be influenced by the foreign installation. The ap can be compared to different parts on earth, some locations we would not want to visit.
Nice linking suspending judgment with preventing shifts influenced by the FI (I am turning this around again). Yes, I could see a range where that applies; I am thinking if that is all it takes to prevent it. Somehow seems too easy . This surely is true, partially, and then there is another part. A different way that the FI can do this, some other lever that it can use. Thinking what it might be… hm are preconceptions basically judgments? They indeed are, just that we are less aware of them, because a lot of them got learned with the whole matrix. Interesting… And of course, there are other forms of self importance than just the thinking that one knows it all and can judge it all. But it is a good link that getting rid of self importance would rid us of judgments, wonder if it would rid us of preconceptions as well, how do you see this?
”Nu Lang” wrote:"Sometimes the collective AP might not be desirable, but if a sorcerer needs to do it, then how does he get out, provided he is impeccable and merges with all his being with that AP?"
Its our individuality and its link with the nagual (these two combined become personal power) that is this cooperative navigational system. That means we are always aware of the nature of awareness itself and its interplay of individual and collective upon us and others. So if a sorcerer is practicing controlled folly, which is what I think you were referring to above, and merges with a collective position, you asked how does he get out of that merging. My answer would be that he never completely merged, only enough to express the sentiment of that position, however his personal power kept him free from annihilation (of his sorcerer awareness) into that collective.
I agree, controlled folly creates this kind of space in between. Between the nothing and the mask. In this space we have the knowledge (somewhere) and intent that it is a mask and this pulls us out. So yes, in this sense one would never completely merge, even if it is looking as any other person. Maybe it is helpful to introduce the notion of personal and impersonal here, as Nu Lang did. That the personal shifts to hold the AP, but the more impersonal keeps the overall stuff, intent, and helps pull us back.
Here I would tie back to what I said before:
I wrote: I think this is where we have to have the pull from the other side so to speak. I think this triggers a sort of remembering, which brings us out of the state. I am not sure if I can call this pull will, it might be, would make sense, but … I am inclined to call [it] the pull of my self, or something to that effect .
So now I have an answer to where more exactly this pull comes from.
This led me to another interesting thought. If even as we are now (most of us) ignorant to our true potential and no self being, if it is not about realizing this space of nothingness in between. This space that we slowly start to make use of, but maybe the biggest feat is to really go there, or be there.
Is that the void? Hm possibly not, I thought this pull is what gets one out of there back into the me, so it would not make sense . Maybe from that space we are closer to the void, maybe from there we can peek into the unknown.
I am most possibly mixing things here that should not be mixed.. but I got a bit exited for a second as these thoughts emerged in me while I was writing my reply. Still I know the mind is not enough to figure stuff out, so I am just leaving this here hanging a bit (because I am not sure I can digest all this now to make sense of it).