10-24-2010, 12:00 AM
Gonzo,
The debate at hand here, which began with your words, is about conflict. You stated earlier it was the primary reason for exisitence in human form. I quote:
"In other words, the production of Loosh, perhaps our primary reason for existing in human form, comes primarily from conflict, not from love and light, which would explain the popularity of war, for example, to date our most dramatic and fascinating invention."Now your recent post seems to have abandoned this completely. So there
is inconsistency in explaining, accounting for your own approach that
actually contradicts what you said. You make have made good chili and
corn bread, but your results here are not as good.
I say its the love for returning to unity that drives us in human form, and showed you how your own actions here were based on this motivation, which is positive. Conflict is only a means of being challenged, but its not a primary reason and serves only a secondary function which is to aid in the overcoming of ignorance.
"The issue is the primary reason for living, or put another way, the purpose of life. The only person I'm interested in helping with understanding is myself. I engage in discussions, often as The Devil's Advocate, often as a provocateur, in order to draw people out especially from behind conventional beliefs. I want to hear why they believe as they do, and further, to hear if they can defeat my own arguments, refute my own beliefs."
Even if your goal is to help only yourself (seeking only unity within you), that's still a positive. Arhats goal is to attain self-enlightenment, unlike a Bodhisattva's. We cannot conclude such a goal is driven by negativity (conflict) as a primary purpose. To elevate the consciousness of just one or to elevate the consciousness of many is a matter of numbers, and within both is spiritual progression (away from ignorance).
"It has nothing to do with healing, helping, aiding, assisting or feeling better. It has all to do with working towards understanding"
If you asked yourself what makes you seek understanding, I think you will find that its the pleasure of such understanding that makes you seek it. Understanding IS feeling better, IS healing...ignorance.
"Since time immemorial all the sages have only spoken of the faults of impurity; if there is no such perverted consciousness, opinion and thought habits, then it is like an autumn pond, limpid and clean. Pure and clear, without contrivance, quiescent and still, without hindrance; such is called a man of the Way. He is also called an unconcerned man."
Ha, sounds like a state of total peace and tranquility doesn't it? You advocate this but not others who say the same (speak of peace) with different words or understandings, but basically both speak of the same endpoint regardless of the paths taken to get there. Your paragraph above is about the end of conflict.
Even the most "evil" being ever spoken of has an interesting myth-story about his origin. The angel Lucifer before his fall from heaven had the task to test humans even then. To do this he had to create havoc, God instructed him to. Your stance says its such conflict that's the primary reason for being human. I say its only secondary, and the fact that being tested only makes us stronger (stronger IB's) shows the primary reason to even do this is positive.
The debate at hand here, which began with your words, is about conflict. You stated earlier it was the primary reason for exisitence in human form. I quote:
"In other words, the production of Loosh, perhaps our primary reason for existing in human form, comes primarily from conflict, not from love and light, which would explain the popularity of war, for example, to date our most dramatic and fascinating invention."Now your recent post seems to have abandoned this completely. So there
is inconsistency in explaining, accounting for your own approach that
actually contradicts what you said. You make have made good chili and
corn bread, but your results here are not as good.
I say its the love for returning to unity that drives us in human form, and showed you how your own actions here were based on this motivation, which is positive. Conflict is only a means of being challenged, but its not a primary reason and serves only a secondary function which is to aid in the overcoming of ignorance.
"The issue is the primary reason for living, or put another way, the purpose of life. The only person I'm interested in helping with understanding is myself. I engage in discussions, often as The Devil's Advocate, often as a provocateur, in order to draw people out especially from behind conventional beliefs. I want to hear why they believe as they do, and further, to hear if they can defeat my own arguments, refute my own beliefs."
Even if your goal is to help only yourself (seeking only unity within you), that's still a positive. Arhats goal is to attain self-enlightenment, unlike a Bodhisattva's. We cannot conclude such a goal is driven by negativity (conflict) as a primary purpose. To elevate the consciousness of just one or to elevate the consciousness of many is a matter of numbers, and within both is spiritual progression (away from ignorance).
"It has nothing to do with healing, helping, aiding, assisting or feeling better. It has all to do with working towards understanding"
If you asked yourself what makes you seek understanding, I think you will find that its the pleasure of such understanding that makes you seek it. Understanding IS feeling better, IS healing...ignorance.
"Since time immemorial all the sages have only spoken of the faults of impurity; if there is no such perverted consciousness, opinion and thought habits, then it is like an autumn pond, limpid and clean. Pure and clear, without contrivance, quiescent and still, without hindrance; such is called a man of the Way. He is also called an unconcerned man."
Ha, sounds like a state of total peace and tranquility doesn't it? You advocate this but not others who say the same (speak of peace) with different words or understandings, but basically both speak of the same endpoint regardless of the paths taken to get there. Your paragraph above is about the end of conflict.
Even the most "evil" being ever spoken of has an interesting myth-story about his origin. The angel Lucifer before his fall from heaven had the task to test humans even then. To do this he had to create havoc, God instructed him to. Your stance says its such conflict that's the primary reason for being human. I say its only secondary, and the fact that being tested only makes us stronger (stronger IB's) shows the primary reason to even do this is positive.