11-05-2017, 12:00 AM
hehe 
. thnx for the humor. And, sry, did not mean to offend you. In retrospect, the masturbating comment was maybe a bit too much, though it did get my message across.
People heal. period. Alone, in groups, with others who are there to help them, etc.
I did not mean that you are masturbating in front of JJ and Sen, but the way you were talking about not allowing others to see you had a weird wtf taste as if you were talking about something, well, like masturbating. Hence the masturbating analogy, to help you understand how it came across. From your response I gather you understood it very well, so the analogy served its purpose in that sense. But then it offended you and we got to where we are now. Oh well...
Ask yourself why you felt the need to put before my eyes that you could not 'masturbate' (i.e. heal) in front of me. I mean really what is the purpose of saying that? Why do you need to tell me this? Given also that I am aware we do not have this kind of relationship (nor is it something you could decide on on your own) - This is what I mean - saying it with that analogy shows you better what my issue with you saying that was. What do you feel I am supposed to do with that info?.
You are not around for my healing process either. It should not be a surprise this is not where we are at you and me. So it is strange that you would feel like commenting on this.
It is like you are trying to poke me and get me to think I have somehow failed you. Or that I am insufficient, not up to your standards of a healing companion. I don't know why you do that, but it sure is strange. From my side of thinds we are not at this spot, you and me, not because you felt me insufficient, though that might be a part of it ofc.
What is even more interesting is that you do not account for the fact that I see you going through this process. When you are around. And then there is the thing that even if I am not there in the room that you 'masturbate' in, I can still see you when you come out . So, the matter of what I see or not is a bit more complicated than whether you actually make the conscious choice of accepting me as someone you can have around in this private room of yours .
----
Pixie wrote:If someone is suicidal, they are bent. It does not help to mention to that individual they are bent. It is clear to many a bent is present. Everyone is bent somewhere and telling them to straighten out does them even less benefit than an unethical psychiatrist/psychologist.
I surely do not have patients whom I tell this as a diagnosis. It does not matter how many other people see there is something bent, as long as the person themselves keeps being oblivious or is lying to themselves about stuff. Anyway, in order to have such a conversation with a person, few things need to be in place. And then, believe it or not, if you get to the bent, the specific part not just in general, it is helpful to know about it. This is what self-stalking is all about. It is very beautiful and satisfying to see people, whose awareness has reached to these areas, gradually change towards more stability. It is one of the most satisfying areas in my life that people around me (that I found receptive and wanting of change) have been able to tackle these parts of themselves with a nudge or with a bit of my input and help - if they asked for it. Not to mention how grateful I am that it could help me when I was in most need (I'd be a very different person otherwise). It is the nicest feeling in the world to see someone heal and grow before your eyes (no matter if you helped a bit or not). In that sense talking to me about how that does not work is futile. It is not so much about it not working as about the person whom it does not work for. People are different and can benefit from different approaches. This one, however, clearly works. But maybe its not for you and yours.
----
Pixie wrote:Ah, you're right. I'm totally not ready and so my teacher hasn't manifested. That must be what happened.
I was using 'teacher' as a metaphor. You were ready because you found people to be vulnerable with and to help you heal. And when you are ready for the next round someone like that will be around again. I'm not sure if you are trying to make me feel bad that I am not one of those people. I do not need to jump into stuff where I am not needed or supposed to be. I am glad you found ways to learn and heal, this is something I like to see around. I do not mind being a witness from further off, it is actually really nice to be one. And I do not need to see you going through the process to find it nice when you come out of your intimate room (with whoever it is you feel can be there with you) and seeing you after that. Cause then I see it anyway.
Pixie wrote:I admire Sen for his ability to listen to you attempt to understand people and events. He's so patient with you in ways I never could be. Maybe Sen would like to explain what I said to you; I trust him to explain me accurately enough based on what I say.
You have said similar a couple of times now and I have found it weird every time.
You know how Sen is different with different people, the more bents the person has the more fluid and less direct Sen becomes to not hit these bends (cause it is a sane reflex not to want to hit/bump into stuff), plus he also accommodates the other type of bents that are not in that person but elsewhere. It is a very good skill, but sadly the people can then ignore the message because it had to go through a few weird curves to get to the person's ears and they can just decide not to hear certain parts it carries. I would have liked to say that you should have talked to Sen and let him tell you how he actually sees things for real
. But you would not have gotten a straight answer . That makes it kinda funny and futile to even try . One could say that it can be hard to be directly honest with people. But the fact is also that it is rarely worth it for people to make themselves open to battle like that. So people like Andrew go in an extremely roundabout way. They often do not tell you what they actually think, not really, because they allow you to carry a different message from their words. They do not tell you that is not what they meant, they leave you with your version. A lot of the message does not go through like that because you can ignore parts and then go on with your version/judgments as you like.
Sen's excuse is then that he did tell you... but I tell him that since he knew for a fact that you did not actually hear/take in an important part of the message that it is as if he had not told you. That he should tell you directly so there is no room for you to look away from it. But he won't do that. It would put too much pressure on himself (and even with that policy of his he had too much pressure on himself, so one cannot blame him, nor would I want to). And in that sense, he can pick his battles. It's his choice. You however, are then left to run with whatever it is you (mis)understood and are able to push Sen to a spot where he has no place being (but he lets you).
Do I need to defend my trustworthiness? Not really... Even though I have a very trustworthy view of myself, I tell it to shut up haha.
It is always fascinating and terrible at the same time how people attempt to understand others based on who they are themselves. What you are saying about me here shows more about you than it does about me. I was not the one who talked of not understanding people and their emotions (if anything I was the one who said almost the exact opposite, about how I could connect to people too easily and see the intricate and detailed shades of their states). I would appreciate if you did not put stuff on me that does not belong there. You might go to some case when I said I do not understand something linked to you... but that is hardly the same thing. (Plus saying something like that is also a maneuver to get people to explain - i.e. to think about something.) See how you made one little thing into a judgment about the whole person (while disregarding other information - seen and heard)?
If we go into the area of expressing what tires us about one another..... You comment on other people so much while using your judgments. That to me is tiring. Even when I do not see where/if they are inaccurate... it is tiring. The thing is, even if your judgments were accurate... why do you feel the need to say them?
I cannot have a discussion with you about well anything without talking about (ex)member's of this site and their issues. Like here we cannot talk about health without you mentioning LW's mental issues (real or imagined). I do not want to analyze kris, shamanka, mornings son, silver wind, etc etc. If you want to talk about issues, talk about your issues. Sometimes it is useful to mention people we both know to make sure we know what we are talking about (to check we are on the same page), but with you it is waaaay beyond that (like there was no need to bring LW into our talk here). You enjoy judging people. I dislike doing so. I want people to have space and not narrow them down to my judgements.
Ofc I also like talking to you. There is no one color - black or white - here for me. I also can find it worthwhile to talk to you and others and even when there are differences I am not one to despair by default, because in certain type of differences there is learning potential. And that is what this place is about . Nevertheless, since you decided you don't wanna interact anymore... it is what it is . No need to respond to my message here, actually, it would be better if you did not. Otherwise you are just inviting another reply. Enjoy interacting with those people you find worthwhile . Over and out .
. thnx for the humor. And, sry, did not mean to offend you. In retrospect, the masturbating comment was maybe a bit too much, though it did get my message across. People heal. period. Alone, in groups, with others who are there to help them, etc.
I did not mean that you are masturbating in front of JJ and Sen, but the way you were talking about not allowing others to see you had a weird wtf taste as if you were talking about something, well, like masturbating. Hence the masturbating analogy, to help you understand how it came across. From your response I gather you understood it very well, so the analogy served its purpose in that sense. But then it offended you and we got to where we are now. Oh well...
Ask yourself why you felt the need to put before my eyes that you could not 'masturbate' (i.e. heal) in front of me. I mean really what is the purpose of saying that? Why do you need to tell me this? Given also that I am aware we do not have this kind of relationship (nor is it something you could decide on on your own) - This is what I mean - saying it with that analogy shows you better what my issue with you saying that was. What do you feel I am supposed to do with that info?
. You are not around for my healing process either. It should not be a surprise this is not where we are at you and me. So it is strange that you would feel like commenting on this.
It is like you are trying to poke me and get me to think I have somehow failed you. Or that I am insufficient, not up to your standards of a healing companion
. I don't know why you do that, but it sure is strange. From my side of thinds we are not at this spot, you and me, not because you felt me insufficient, though that might be a part of it ofc. What is even more interesting is that you do not account for the fact that I see you going through this process
. When you are around. And then there is the thing that even if I am not there in the room that you 'masturbate' in, I can still see you when you come out . So, the matter of what I see or not is a bit more complicated than whether you actually make the conscious choice of accepting me as someone you can have around in this private room of yours . ----
Pixie wrote:If someone is suicidal, they are bent. It does not help to mention to that individual they are bent. It is clear to many a bent is present. Everyone is bent somewhere and telling them to straighten out does them even less benefit than an unethical psychiatrist/psychologist.
I surely do not have patients whom I tell this as a diagnosis. It does not matter how many other people see there is something bent, as long as the person themselves keeps being oblivious or is lying to themselves about stuff. Anyway, in order to have such a conversation with a person, few things need to be in place. And then, believe it or not, if you get to the bent, the specific part not just in general, it is helpful to know about it. This is what self-stalking is all about. It is very beautiful and satisfying to see people, whose awareness has reached to these areas, gradually change towards more stability. It is one of the most satisfying areas in my life that people around me (that I found receptive and wanting of change) have been able to tackle these parts of themselves with a nudge or with a bit of my input and help - if they asked for it. Not to mention how grateful I am that it could help me when I was in most need (I'd be a very different person otherwise). It is the nicest feeling in the world to see someone heal and grow before your eyes (no matter if you helped a bit or not). In that sense talking to me about how that does not work is futile
. It is not so much about it not working as about the person whom it does not work for. People are different and can benefit from different approaches. This one, however, clearly works. But maybe its not for you and yours.----
Pixie wrote:Ah, you're right. I'm totally not ready and so my teacher hasn't manifested. That must be what happened.
I was using 'teacher' as a metaphor. You were ready because you found people to be vulnerable with and to help you heal. And when you are ready for the next round someone like that will be around again. I'm not sure if you are trying to make me feel bad that I am not one of those people. I do not need to jump into stuff where I am not needed or supposed to be. I am glad you found ways to learn and heal, this is something I like to see around. I do not mind being a witness from further off, it is actually really nice to be one. And I do not need to see you going through the process to find it nice when you come out of your intimate room (with whoever it is you feel can be there with you) and seeing you after that. Cause then I see it anyway
.Pixie wrote:I admire Sen for his ability to listen to you attempt to understand people and events. He's so patient with you in ways I never could be. Maybe Sen would like to explain what I said to you; I trust him to explain me accurately enough based on what I say.
You have said similar a couple of times now and I have found it weird every time
.You know how Sen is different with different people, the more bents the person has the more fluid and less direct Sen becomes to not hit these bends (cause it is a sane reflex not to want to hit/bump into stuff), plus he also accommodates the other type of bents that are not in that person but elsewhere. It is a very good skill, but sadly the people can then ignore the message because it had to go through a few weird curves to get to the person's ears and they can just decide not to hear certain parts it carries. I would have liked to say that you should have talked to Sen and let him tell you how he actually sees things for real
. But you would not have gotten a straight answer . That makes it kinda funny and futile to even try . One could say that it can be hard to be directly honest with people. But the fact is also that it is rarely worth it for people to make themselves open to battle like that. So people like Andrew go in an extremely roundabout way. They often do not tell you what they actually think, not really, because they allow you to carry a different message from their words. They do not tell you that is not what they meant, they leave you with your version. A lot of the message does not go through like that because you can ignore parts and then go on with your version/judgments as you like.Sen's excuse is then that he did tell you... but I tell him that since he knew for a fact that you did not actually hear/take in an important part of the message that it is as if he had not told you. That he should tell you directly so there is no room for you to look away from it. But he won't do that. It would put too much pressure on himself (and even with that policy of his he had too much pressure on himself, so one cannot blame him, nor would I want to). And in that sense, he can pick his battles. It's his choice. You however, are then left to run with whatever it is you (mis)understood and are able to push Sen to a spot where he has no place being (but he lets you).
Do I need to defend my trustworthiness?
Not really... Even though I have a very trustworthy view of myself, I tell it to shut up haha.It is always fascinating and terrible at the same time how people attempt to understand others based on who they are themselves. What you are saying about me here shows more about you than it does about me. I was not the one who talked of not understanding people and their emotions (if anything I was the one who said almost the exact opposite, about how I could connect to people too easily and see the intricate and detailed shades of their states). I would appreciate if you did not put stuff on me that does not belong there. You might go to some case when I said I do not understand something linked to you... but that is hardly the same thing. (Plus saying something like that is also a maneuver to get people to explain - i.e. to think about something.) See how you made one little thing into a judgment about the whole person (while disregarding other information - seen and heard)?
If we go into the area of expressing what tires us about one another..... You comment on other people so much while using your judgments. That to me is tiring. Even when I do not see where/if they are inaccurate... it is tiring. The thing is, even if your judgments were accurate... why do you feel the need to say them?
I cannot have a discussion with you about well anything without talking about (ex)member's of this site and their issues. Like here we cannot talk about health without you mentioning LW's mental issues (real or imagined). I do not want to analyze kris, shamanka, mornings son, silver wind, etc etc. If you want to talk about issues, talk about your issues. Sometimes it is useful to mention people we both know to make sure we know what we are talking about (to check we are on the same page), but with you it is waaaay beyond that (like there was no need to bring LW into our talk here). You enjoy judging people. I dislike doing so. I want people to have space and not narrow them down to my judgements.
Ofc I also like talking to you. There is no one color - black or white - here for me. I also can find it worthwhile to talk to you and others and even when there are differences I am not one to despair by default
, because in certain type of differences there is learning potential. And that is what this place is about . Nevertheless, since you decided you don't wanna interact anymore... it is what it is . No need to respond to my message here, actually, it would be better if you did not. Otherwise you are just inviting another reply. Enjoy interacting with those people you find worthwhile . Over and out .