Was Castaneda a fraud?

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Was he in your eyes?

[Aranno Way]

Someone has to ask themselves, if they themselves are a fraud.

[Sidarthur Prospero]

It doesnt matter whether Castaneda was a fraud or not. If anyone finds the lessons of don Juan useful then USE THEM. If not then DONT USE THEM. Its amazing how simple the answer is and how complicated idiots want to make this issue. Liars want to incriminate Castaneda for being a liar. How ridiculous! That **** Ghost Dog was a guy who really enjoyed lying and didnt mind getting caught in his lies, yet he was so certain Castaneda was a liar and that was bad.
Jerk!

[Aranno Way]

This is why I did not give Ghost Dog any of my time except to shove up his ass that he only followed the agenda of the acedamia and that "he" never had a true original thought of his own because he was taught what to think and what to reflect and was paid money to do so.
That is the nature of his game.
On this point on his site he had nothing to say and it shut WuWie and G.D. and associates right the ****.

[Guest]

I'm in full agreement. Comes as a real surprise, right?

[Guest]

The Poster Aranno Hay is Not Aranno Way.
This poster is not to be confused with Aranno Way, my brother, who just called to let me know.
Wakulla

[mybelovedmateria]

he *is* a *good* fraud

[Sidarthur Prospero]

Well, hellllllo there, Aranno Way! Thought you could pull the the foreskin over my head, did you?

[Guest]

it does mater if casatneta was a fraud

[charlila]

aranno
GD paid? by whom?

[greenriverknight]

IF YOU WOULD JUST LIVE THE DESCRIPTION HE PUT FORTH IN THE BOOKS. IT THEN WOULD BE RELEGATED TO WHAT IT REALLY IS. ULTRA IMPERSONAL. And it wouldn't matter.
HE DID ALOT TO GET RID OF OUR EGO.
Funking Ego. So this 'dubunking' myth we live is only a by-product of New Age Shamanism and that's all.
YOU NEED TO ASK YOURSELF ARE WE ON THIS Carlos Castaneda PATH OR NOT? We're not. We're not interested in the human unknown/ We're after the non-human unknown, he said. So before you determine what's what ask yourself this. Please sir please.

[Guest]

Definitely a fraud and that' all that matters.

[Guest]

If Castaneda was a truly genuine fraud then he was indeed real and not a fraud at all. D">

[Guest]

I feel all that matters is whether the lessons of Castaneda's don Juan are useful or not. If they are useful what difference does it make if people think Castaneda was a fraud?

[Guest]

Castaneda was a fraud. No doubt about it and that really matter. Those who read his books should know

[avadhut1008]

Castaneda was not a fraud.
He was a Nagual with a serious lack of impecabillity. Don Juan knew this and that is why he predicted (and it's mentioned in the books) that his particular lineage ended with Carlos.
Instead of being a Nagual with a private party of should-be Naguals he began an open party of wannabe-naguals, something that came from his tonal (ego) rather than his Nagual.
His books are great and very helpful, but he himself failed as a Nagual... I think.

[Bob Carr]

Good observation. I have addressed this on other threads.
The narrative of Castaneda's books seem incomplete. Characters, events and systems just come to a dead end.
Nonetheless, there is enough available to point the way, and there are other resources that inform.
Me, I am working with Silence of Mind, removal of Indulgences, Equality of Creation , the Warriors Stand and anything else I can grab onto as a Seer.Hawkeye and Crow

[avadhut1008]

I sort of had the intuition from the start that Castaneda wasn't a good apprendice. In most of the books you will see Juan Matus trying constantly to talk some sense to Carlitos. At some point he confesses his true dislike of Carlitos, but thanks him for the lesson of tolerance.
It was the Intent of Power that Castaneda should learn the ways of nagualism... I'am not sure that it was the Intent of Juan Matus.
There is also a rare episode... when one of the witches tries to kill Carlitos in order to take the Power-of-the-Nagual that he got from Juan Matus.
She even says that it was Juan Matus idea and he even put in the details. Lucky Carlitos, his Energy Doble save him.
An interesting loop in Castaneda's Cronicles is the mention of 7 gates of dreaming and the fact that not even Don Juan knew for experience the forth gate of dreaming.
But this issues may be for another posts.

[Vrill]

I met Castaneda and he was not a fraud.




Let's define the term "fraud" as a person that intentionally deludes, misleads, cheats or steals from other people.


That was not Carlos.




Castaneda was a damn good storyteller!




He was a Coyote, a Heyoka, who knew how to lie well. With people like that, they themselves never know which end is up.




But I think he was deadly serious in his intent. He gift was his writing and his supreme wit.




One of my other teachers, Gurdjieff, was an extreme paradox as well. It's tough for us "mere mortals" to judge beings of another order.


They do things that make sense to them and to "Objective Reality", while to us the actions appear contradictory, random and chaotic.




When we demand a rational explanation we get stony silence. For them, the explanations are yesterdays news.




Don Juan only gave explanations as pointing out instructions to a ripened awareness.

[ARNWAY]

I as anyone have realized by now that the media will not give you one inch of room to express topics of time to talk about the issues of Nagualism in any shape
or form to talk about elements of the matrix of our social makeup and the apparent mechanism that keeps us at bay to not question them.






My stand is that I don't trust any establishished media or so callled authority to have ant fucking say on this matter of "Nagualism".




BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT QUALIFIED TO SAY ANYTHING BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT AUTHORIZED ON THIS SUBJECT BECAUSE THEY DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT TO JUDGE US
ON OUR ACTIVITIES.

[mybelovedmateria]

He was a fraud.


He said, "if you do recapitulation and tensegrity, and accumulate enough energy to be able to make it to the other world then I'll find you and help
you there. I'll find you, I promise."


He must have known that this promise is ridiculous since thousands of people might come to the position where he'd have to fulfill it with them, and that
would have been too much for him.


So it was a fraudulent statement, however given in the desire of spurring and helping people.




He was a *good* fraud, as I said before.




Actually everything was too big for him, but he wanted to build it by all means, even if he'd have to choose questionable methods. (And he was a bit silly
and din't understand everything well enough to be really smart, but desperately wanted to be smart, that also.)

[Blue totem]

It way be a little crazy to believe in Castaneda. But....




In this case, on Castaneda, I don't think it`s smart to just believe or just to disbelieve.




From experience I know many things in his books are true.


Maybe experience is the only way to give some credit to Castaneda`s legacy...


I don't expect any sorcerer to convince anyone about nagualism. In sorcery, seeing is believing. Like in many things.




Also, the question is different for seers and non-seers. Do you believe in the technical aspects of sorcery-nagualism,


or do you believe in the stories and scenarios of Castaneda. Which are two different things.




The vast majority of people see Castaneda`s books as fantasy style literature. The usual reflex is to disbelieve.


Only a very small portion of people can give any credit to Castaneda`s writings.




Myself, I believe in sorcery. But I`m not so sure about the stories and the characters in the books.


One way or the other, Castaneda's books are great. So I don't really care if it was real or not...


I think Castaneda made great efforts to describe Don Juan's reality, and this should not be taken for granted.


And weather Don Juan was real or not, you have to marvel at Castaneda's creativity and style of writing.




Maybe he created scenarios to teach sorcery to people. Maybe not. Anyway, I love his books.

[Hawkeye Crow]

There is a local radio show on spirituality , www.viratolive.com On this show was a Toltec explorer named Kenneth Smith , also Ken Eaglefeather ,
director at The Institute of Thearaputic Discovery www.titd.org His work is also at www.noetic.org




He offered some good descriptions of the energy body and how it works. He defended Castaneda , and claimed to have met Don Juan Matus , which he said was an
alias. He spoke of shamanism in general with an emphasis on the Toltec.




What I got out if it was that he seemed able to put the ideas CC wrote about in a more understandable , more accessible form , in words.




Check it out.

[Guest]