The Stoners

[Guest]

Who are the stoners?  The people who like to cuss and cry anytime something doesn't go their way.
These are the people who like to say, "Spirit told me!", "Power told me!", "NLW's nuts told me!" as a sort of end-solution to their actions, opinions, and thoughts.  

Yes!  This explains everything!  Why didn't I think of using that?!  I will use that end-solution for all my interactions from this point forward; it is such a simple idea, why hadn't I considered it before?  

Sigh.  It saddens me when I see this.  I mean, how do I respond to that argument.  It stops me dead in my tracks.  First I wonder if this was done on purpose, could this person really be this retarded?  Do they truly think this all purpose explanation will add any validity to their argument?  They must if they use it.  

Or.

Perhaps they are just fucking with me.  Yes, it must be the this one because nobody would be silly enough to say this in an actual argument.  Ok, so they're saying this just to *** with me.  Now things may progress further within my mind.

I find something witty to say back, "Yes!  You are right!  Spirit must have intended it so."  Discussion fades.  New topic arises.  Now they complain about something.  I recall my newly found logic and have the desire to apply it.

"Well, if it occurred, doesn't it mean Spirit intended it to?"

"No!  That person must be stopped!  I will do it, put them in their place, get rid of them, because Spirit intends me to."

"Wait, I'm confused now.  Do you mean to say Spirit made a mistake and sent you to fix it?"

"I don't know these things, what the plans are, I just act on the whims of Spirit.  I know nothing.  I am unconcerned."

"If you're unconcerned, why not drop it?"

"Because I am unconcerned, I will involve myself and set things right."

"Ummmmm, wait.  I'm confused.  Can you re-explain this, but barney style for me?"

[seesaw]

Funny Kao, also true.

I recently asked NLW a question about dreaming. Now i will be curious as to his answer but i wonder why i really asked it. I dont know anything about the guy. I get the idea he dreams well, but do i know? No. So why should i trust his advice beyond my own gut? Like i said i will be curious to read his response but ill be frank, the only person who is going to do stuff for me is me.

So, when someone turns to me and says 'spirit told me', well thats all well and dandy for them. The thing is, if spirit hasn't told me and just sent some fucked up human to tell me what i should do in my life, then i am not just going to accept what they say as gospel truth. Thats a leap too far.

Should i just have utter faith in what such people say and fly contrary to what i feel and believe? If i want to act like an irresponsible d head, yeah sure. Otherwise, no.

If i turn it around, would such people do what i want them to if it ran contrary to their current experience? Should i reasonably expect them to do things totally outside of what they are, unsupported by their current experience?

From previous attempts to wish people into being what i want them to be, i see that it rarely happens. I have come to view such things as a vanity, a stupid one. Even if i do it from an altered state, its still a vanity, one made from an altered state. When true power acts it does so without me needing to voice it. Things just shift, almost despite of me. Power is power. Its not anything to do with reason or thinking. Its outside of that. It rarely needs a page of text and justifications to do its thing.

My current belief is that if its written on a forum, or they said it via their mouth then thats not spirit telling me, (unless of course there is something amazing about the circumstances that draws my attention to it.) Now, if they said it to me in a dream, or as a crow, or a duck or anything outside normal consensus reality that may be different. Then yes ill admit its pretty darned odd and maybe the grand ole spirit at large is telling me to pay attention.

I prefer to keep certain boundaries clear. Nagual is dealt with by Nagual, tonal belongs to tonal. These halfway states are just a bloody mess. Was it spirit that said it to me or was it an exalted idea of someone elses self? Was it a western fart or the archetype of a divac reincarnation in the fashion of boddhisattva. That sort of thinking fatigues me. Got no time for it anymore.

Till then i am learning not to trust people. Sure i trust that they experience all sorts of things. But thats them, also im just not so sure about their interpretations. Especially when instead of a description of an experience they had, i get just the extrapolated interpretation given to me as the experience. The two things are very different.

One starts with ' i saw.......
The other start with 'You have to.......

By the way, spirit didnt tell me to write this. Hands Kao a rational stick.

[Guest]

Thank you so much for breaking this down for me, Seesaw. I see the error in my thinking, it's not just to *** with me after all. It sounds like these people are serious. Now this makes much more sense.

They have their own set of experiences which are believable for them. Good enough for them. Yet because I'm different, I should listen to my gut, find truth in a manner which makes sense for me.

Hmmmm. I have to consider this; not listening to what Spirit passes along through a fucked up human. That brings up a nice connection for, actually. I often don't believe in 'messengers' or 'the middle man' when it comes to Spirit. Since it comes back to what you mentioned, power doesn't need to be written on a forum. It simply acts.

Good stuff right there, I like your barney style explanation.

[Guest]

Er, to clarify, I DO believe in messengers but it's more in the realm of the examples you gave; dreaming, crows, and ducks (ie not from other normal humans unless under exceptional circumstances.)

[Littlepaw]

I thought a stoner was someone who smokes allot of pot?

[Guest]

That's one definition, sure.

[Guest]

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