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These aliases, and alters can be a real thing for a lot of people. People spend loads of time, energy and awareness that could be much more proficiently utilized, upholding these aliases and attempting to fool people, and thus suck their energy. In the past few weeks I have seen a bit of this, but just don't have the gumption to try and prove to those who don't see as I do. The way I see, folks, no matter what name they choose to use on an internet forum, have a definite energy signature. It is that signature that first hits me before I read a post, or hear what the person has to say. That signature is not dependent on region, location or IP address and that signature, though folks do go to great lengths to try hide it, can not be hidden well!
So following I will tell a story, not in my own words, but narrated by one in our midst with a propensity for story telling herself and with a knack, shall we say, of creating characters and then living up to them almost fully. At least, as fully as one can--- on the Net.
Why do I bother? Perhaps you can figure that out!
Killing The Cast and Tossing Stones From My Pocket
In the beginning of this task I was rather inept and made loads of mistakes that although they went mostly unnoticed, I didn’t feel that they were successful because the movement of the AP was unpredictable, hard to control, and just as often didn’t happen. Then, as I began to discover *what* made this actually work (meaning moving the AP) and exactly what role *intent* played in its success, and as I did it, as I went through the process it became easier to craft convincing and unforgettable characters. For this reason the stones of my earlier characters have already been cast aside, have been removed from your active consciousness, and need no further mention.
The only characters that remain in active consciousness at this point and for which I feel require further mention and in honor of my time, energy, and devotion to each of these characters I now release them.
Forest Wolf 1 (the new female, submissive, serious)
John Spirit Warrior (a lead male)
Raven his sister [/b] (like John only female)
Sheila (a more subdued and gentle form of John who keeps a professional decorum)
Matt (the male embodiment of the female heart)
Forest Wolf 2 (the old female, non submissive, not serious)
Of all of these characters, only Forest Wolf 2 was created with the *intent* to render this process visible, and this intent for visibility was directed almost solely towards Transistor, and it was for this reason that she was created with an obvious flaw of being opposite of Forest Wolf 1. Still, it is fitting that she is the one to make the final chronicle entry…for perhaps no other character of mine has illustrated quite as thoroughly as Forest Wolf 2, the onlooker’s incessant and overpowering desire for illusion over reality.
I have moved beyond this task.
No further explanation is necessary.
≈∆
We may now add Sedna to this list of characters of the charade and, to tell the truth, the rest of them, will become visible in due time. I suggest everyone remains on the look-out, not in a paranoid way, but carefully, for people who pretend to be something they are not.
There is only one reason for this kind of behaviour and it is not a stalking maneuver. This is done to MANIPULATE YOU! Is that what you want?
Didn't think so.
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Anyway, in case my point wasn't clear in the previous post, let me re-state.
In the case of Forest Wolf, Sedna and the multitude of characters now and in between, this is not a master
stalker – because lying is not stalking, and playing characters is
easy. Especially on the internet full of people wanting to learn and wanting to be heard. Lying is not stalking, pretending is not stalking, astral projecting to people while they are sleeping is not stalking, it's all a sham!
If she were a gifted dreamer or proficient seer, stalking would involve herself, not other people. It’s always those who don’t have the skills that
play.
…. Always
The price game players play is that they don’t matter to anyone. Sadly, not even to themselves.
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"Everyone can see, and yet we choose not to remember what we see ."
Second Ring of Power
CC
We are each utterly responsible for where we choose to place ourselves,
and if we place ourselves in to the company of others, then we can not
blame them for being themselves. No one does anything to anyone, least
of all to a warrior.
Anyone who gets that has not been played, and comes
out on top, no matter what.
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You fail to mention Digital Noir (Stephen Gould), a science fiction author, who has played a role. It's quite conceivable he has been a factor in the role playing. In fact, at one point, FW mentioned creating a screenplay, or perhaps some sort of a standup routine based on Internet dialogs.
With that said, I still cannot condemn her/his actions. If you and others are so capable of "reading" her energetic signature, then what is the problem? She is "known" to you and therefore powerless. Are you trying to protect others or continuing to defend yourself from prior events?
I still maintain that even though painful, lessons learned from any con are of more value than those from let's say more gentle and compassionate means. Once again, you cannot con an honest man, and anyone getting sucked in by her cons falls into the "dishonest" category, most often dishonest in terms of self-importance.
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Gonzo wrote:
You fail to mention Digital Noir (Stephen Gould), a science fiction author, who has played a role. It's quite conceivable he has been a factor in the role playing. In fact, at one point, FW mentioned creating a screenplay, or perhaps some sort of a standup routine based on Internet dialogs.
With that said, I still cannot condemn her/his actions. If you and others are so capable of "reading" her energetic signature, then what is the problem? She is "known" to you and therefore powerless. Are you trying to protect others or continuing to defend yourself from prior events?
I still maintain that even though painful, lessons learned from any con are of more value than those from let's say more gentle and compassionate means. Once again, you cannot con an honest man, and anyone getting sucked in by her cons falls into the "dishonest" category, most often dishonest in terms of self-importance.
You have defended this person for years, and seem to be in abject admiration of the chaos she caused. That being the case, I can only conclude that you are the type who intentionally drops the soap in the prison shower, all the while pretending it was just an innocent "accident" when Bubba takes you up on the invitation. Put more simply: you seem to enjoy getting screwed.
There is no time for role-playing when one fully acknowledges that s/he is a being who is going to die.
The authentic self is not an avatar on the internet.
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Gonzo,
I am sure there are a dozen (or more) characters that I haven't mentioned. Most of those being the recent ones. Am I attempting to protect others? Not really, but knowledge is power and the more people know, the more they can make informed decisions about what to do in the face of such sham and charlatan!
A game is a game,
Is a game for true,
but if I don't know
I'm playing
the only loser is you!
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alien wrote:
There is no time for role-playing when one fully acknowledges that s/he is a being who is going to die.
The authentic self is not an avatar on the internet.
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alien wrote:Gonzo wrote:
You fail to mention Digital Noir (Stephen Gould), a science fiction author, who has played a role. It's quite conceivable he has been a factor in the role playing. In fact, at one point, FW mentioned creating a screenplay, or perhaps some sort of a standup routine based on Internet dialogs.
With that said, I still cannot condemn her/his actions. If you and others are so capable of "reading" her energetic signature, then what is the problem? She is "known" to you and therefore powerless. Are you trying to protect others or continuing to defend yourself from prior events?
I still maintain that even though painful, lessons learned from any con are of more value than those from let's say more gentle and compassionate means. Once again, you cannot con an honest man, and anyone getting sucked in by her cons falls into the "dishonest" category, most often dishonest in terms of self-importance.
You have defended this person for years, and seem to be in abject admiration of the chaos she caused. That being the case, I can only conclude that you are the type who intentionally drops the soap in the prison shower, all the while pretending it was just an innocent "accident" when Bubba takes you up on the invitation. Put more simply: you seem to enjoy getting screwed.
There is no time for role-playing when one fully acknowledges that s/he is a being who is going to die.
The authentic self is not an avatar on the internet.
I fail to see how you can say I am defending anything, either her or her actions, any more than I would defend guys running the shell game. A con is a con, and if done well, lures in the suckers. Is the realm of spirituality restricted from cons? Try watching TV preachers some time...watch the movie "Elmer Gantry" - there are probably more spiritual cons than any other.
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Enchantra wrote:Gonzo,
I am sure there are a dozen (or more) characters that I haven't mentioned. Most of those being the recent ones. Am I attempting to protect others? Not really, but knowledge is power and the more people know, the more they can make informed decisions about what to do in the face of such sham and charlatan!
A game is a game,
Is a game for true,
but if I don't know
I'm playing
the only loser is you!
Whether she has more nyms or not is not really important. In effect, she's no bigger sham than many other spiritual con men. If you get taken in by her, it's because you have fallen for one of her cons, as I mentioned. That is, you want something, and she has an uncanny knack for knowing exactly what that is.
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Gonzo wrote:
I fail to see how you can say I am defending anything, either her or her actions, any more than I would defend guys running the shell game. A con is a con, and if done well, lures in the suckers. Is the realm of spirituality restricted from cons? Try watching TV preachers some time...watch the movie "Elmer Gantry" - there are probably more spiritual cons than any other.
You've used terms such as "admiring" the con which was perpetrated by FW, and comparing it to the Nagual Julian's stunt re the four Tulios. My return argument has always been (and still remains) that NO skill or cunning is required to pull off a con on the internet because you can pretend to be anyone or anything, and without face to face personal contact, it is virtually impossible for MOST people to see through the lies. Fortunately for myself, Enchantra and a few others, the "energy signature" of FW is virtually unmistakable, so there were - thankfully - a few who couldn't be taken in by the ruse. We tried to warn the rest of ya, but you were too busy being taken in to even consider that you'd been taken in. Heh.
Bottom line: FW was no Julian. You can put a jockey on a jackass, but he'll never be a racehorse.
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enchantra alos known as Morning star..also know as Mary frost also known as snowdreamer also known as Lori also know as goodness knows what else
has the only the right to talk about herself here.....
yes beware the manipulator..
BTW if you see Phantom on my IP address..its not me its my eldest son..he doesnt require a red carpet ..but he doesnt require to be identified as me and treated accordingly either...lololol
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shamanka wrote:
enchantra alos known as Morning star..also know as Mary frost also known as snowdreamer also known as Lori also know as goodness knows what else
has the only the right to talk about herself here.....
yes beware the manipulator..
BTW if you see Phantom on my IP address..its not me its my eldest son..he doesnt require a red carpet ..but he doesnt require to be identified as me and treated accordingly either...lolololShamanka...
The difference is that Lori didn't set out to intentionally deceive anyone. Many folks have more than one account, but there is no intent to defraud, as was the case with ForestWolf/Sedna/Matt et al. There was once a guy on another forum who changed his name and his avatar almost daily - and, as I recall, there was a member on this forum who did that as well. That's not really the problem, because I think people change their avatar and identity according to their "mood". I have no problem with that.
The real issue is when someone with an agenda sets their intent to defraud, deceive and derail others - as was undeniably the case with FW. I confronted her many times, asking her directly, "Are you Matt?" "Are you Digital Noir?" She always protested, claimed innocence, and went right on deceiving. Had I asked Lori, "Are you snowdreamer?" there would have been no attempt to deceive. She would've laughed and said, "Sure. It was snowing here this morning." That simple. At least that's my perception of Lori.
The problem lies in the intent of the deceiver - which is where the ForestWolfs and the Sednas of the world come into play.
Just my observations, fwiw.
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your experience..your perception of her intent....fair enough
some people use masks for power and some for freedom within interaction.....
morality / immorality is a debatable concept anyway.
and there are no rules..no self..no rules...no boundaries.....i don't have a problem with 'masks' i don't use them myself on the internaet but i have painted them on before now..if i shift, i shift from within...no doubt, no way is better than another...i'm just sick of the double standards of calling someone, for doing something that you do, but deny doing in an agenda power based posting of"look i know who you are..recognise me, recognise me"
i just thought id play the same game for a second, to see what it felt like.....mmmmm playground behaviour of a victimised 5 year old...yuk, im stepping out!
lets have it all out in the open i say..and go "who gives a ****?"
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i was role-playing on this forum.. its called hypocrisy.
Castaneda followers or new agers, cultish role players on this forum with their own believe system, "glossary", and terminology are great hypocrites.. and lunatics as well
you can only have yourself (oneself) as a refugee.. Buddha
Fellow people are telling you if you are insane.
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scout1 wrote:i was role-playing on this forum.. its called hypocrisy.
Castaneda followers or new agers, cultish role players on this forum with their own believe system, "glossary", and terminology are great hypocrites.. and lunatics as well
you can only have yourself (oneself) as a refugee.. Buddha
Fellow people are telling you if you are insane.Scout1 are you insane?
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This thread has some interesting potential. The whole idea of roleplaying is in fact quite fascinating, especially if we do it on a grand scale. Obviously i have come here at the end of a certain amount of internet theatre that has been played out before my arrival. I see a few comments from people that objected to interacting with others who were 'experimenting' on the internet. My personal view is that it is only self importance that objects to such things. Underneath that perhaps self pity. Yes i know that sounds harsh but what else can it be?
OK putting that idea aside for a moment and getting back to the main point i want to raise.
I too have toyed with the idea of presenting different personalities over the internet, just out of curiosity really. As i see it, if it is done right then we can really get to be and feel ourselves as different, and that is pure gold.
I wonder about actually setting up an experimental area here on the forum where people can experiment with new roles. Other members can interact with them if they wish, in fact by interacting with them in this way they could actually help consolidate new personalities. An actual collaborative stalking exercise. Its just an idea but it might be fun. I'd be interested to hear anyone elses thoughts on the matter.
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seesaw, I think if that idea would take off and create a site where it would not be just 3 people playing 10 , then it might be good. Basically because of such an agreement existing there and being accepted. I do not 'role play' on sites such as these because I know not everyone likes it. But on a site where there is an agreement and that is made for that purpose it would be different. I have to say that I do see some benefits in it. For example we take things others say differently sometimes if we know the nick and if we do not. I like to take all from infinity, thankfully I am good at looking at what people say from more than one level. However, I am quite mindful of others and also I do not wish to play games with people. I still come to the thought though that it might be quite a good exercise to write as somebody else-me. Shed some sort of layer that forms me right now. Do things I do not usually do. But let me also say these boundaries are just because we allow them. Basically I am changing as I am and right now I can do things I could not do a just 2 months ago (in terms of character). So no need to act as a different persona to draw this into my life, I am quite fine with my normal way of going about changing myself for the better. One could say I am more curious than thinking it will bring some asset into my life. If I thought the latter I'd be doing it right now..
sometimes people use a different nick to say stuff to clean their hands of saying it while being under their usual name. this is somehow not really good. we should not feel the need to do stuff like this. also acting as if somebody else agrees with us when it is just us again is quite stupid . And yes, I have seen this done on sites such as these .
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Ok i can read between the lines and excuse me if i am repeating ideas but imagine experimenting with a personality that was fixed inflexible rude and intentionally insulting. Take all the opposites of what you are now. Imagine doing this with me because i have no idea who you are.I have no personal history tying you to any notions about you. I am quite happy to play this with you if you want to explore. Get into character body positions attitudes moods feelings retorts whatever comes.Hell even get into the zone by developing a new history. Perceptual flexibility is what we are after and some times we need to be utter assholes to find what this really is.
I had another idea about this too. How about acting in real life what we have been in dreams, or have powerfully witnessed in others. Any form of attitude or personality that has singled out to us by the abstract.
The next level of this would get really interesting- taking these new positions out into the real world as acts of perceptual magic. But first things first.
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seesaw wrote:Ok i can read between the lines and excuse me if i am repeating ideas but imagine experimenting with a personality that was fixed inflexible rude and intentionally insulting.
The thing is I truly did need some help before to be able to be rude and insulting. Erm might still need some. Or to express myself without caring about whatever others. Have made some progress on that front, still wish to push that boundary a bit further. But one thing is being able to do it and another is doing it as a default. My take on things is that one should be able to chose the mode, so to speak. I wished to be able to chose that mode consciously not just when the situation invariably demanded it (meaning I really had no other viable option and shifted there because of that) . Now that I can influence it more, it is as close as another AP position, there might be no need to play with that stuff. When I say I still might want to push the boundary a bit further I am just talking about finding the right margin for my daily life/personality. I remember thinking before that playing an internet persona of a different character might help, but then I somehow got there even without that.
There is a difference in these two ways of getting there. One, the one I took, is coming from within. Here one takes care of whatever it was that was standing in the way of this fluidity. The second one, the internet role playing, is from without/outside - by doing it one learns the position of that AP and how it is/feels thus one is able to be like that, which might or might not dissolve the inner reasons/blockages that were preventing one to be like that before. Generally it might just be an outside role while the inner reasons still block the person to be like that in real life, or in the persona that is his main. Then it really is not much of a win, just a game. Might help get some energy flowing but that is all. Could be helpful for some time and after that it will be just another fixed role.
What do you think?
seesaw wrote:Take all the opposites of what you are now.
Hm, would have to think about that. Not sure I know what opposites would be, but I can sure think of something I am generally not acting like .
heh apart from the rudeness aspect I would not know what the opposites of me are (am hopefully more fluid than that). I would have to put in some nasty stuff, not sure I can. It is one thing to be rude and another to be hateful or full of bile or nervous, not in a good state. I mean what good would that do? Some thing I can do and see as helpful another thing I cannot (unless it is functional in some situation where I truly deem necessary to show it). I could only act as if and that is hollow, would not convince anyone worth their salt. True stalking is shifting to that AP and then it comes with all the stuff. Hm, or is it? As we can be angry without feeling anger - but that is controlled folly. And can we be hateful without feeling hate? I guess it could be done. I would have to create some kind of shifty evil goblin character lol. The thing here would be what would be the reason to spread this kind of stuff around. We already got enough of that on the net.
And an opposite of me would also be someone who does not say much, but putting that into internet reality is quite hard .
seesaw wrote:Imagine doing this with me because i have no idea who you are. I have no personal history tying you to any notions about you. I am quite happy to play this with you if you want to explore. Get into character body positions attitudes moods feelings retorts whatever comes.Hell even get into the zone by developing a new history. Perceptual flexibility is what we are after and some times we need to be utter assholes to find what this really is.
Heh, thnx (truly). Right now I am a bit different than what I was for a few years so I am just examining myself how that plays out for me and also for this site. People here also do not have personal history with me, I have been posting here for a short time. The thing is I wish people to know who I am not who I am not, although knowing what you are not is a big part of who you are . I am sure you know what I mean. What good would it serve to be an arrogant ****? (should work at losing SI not gaining it) What good would in it be for me and for the others? I am quite a practical person, so unless I see some merit in it I am not driven to do stuff like that. I might hold you on that offer though . Should be some fun too.
seesaw wrote:I had another idea about this too. How about acting in real life what we have been in dreams, or have powerfully witnessed in others. Any form of attitude or personality that has singled out to us by the abstract.
The next level of this would get really interesting- taking these new positions out into the real world as acts of perceptual magic. But first things first.
Hm in dreaming I am usually like I am in terms of personality. Just a bit more ruthless and no nonsense, so basically I am moving towards that. So doing what you just speak of here. I find dreaming truly helpful for these kind of changes of self.
nice talking to you
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The reason for doing this?
pure fucking delight.
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lol, ok. I did say it should be fun..
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Lol - fantastic job at keeping it up ... all we need now is rosy to document this experience for you, seesaw.
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Soooooooo WG, when do you want to do it?
I will make myself available for this, but now its time for you to find this new aspect to flesh out. If you need another witness to help you find this, go get one. Kaomea inadvertently suggested using Rosy for this. Lets assume that was the 'spirit' talking, and not her. If we need to organise anything we can do this through the chosen witness. (Its like triangulation of perception.) Get your people (rosy) to contact my people (me)and lets get this on .
Time to dust off the theatre curtains.
No more words, its crunch time.... I have finished talking to you in your current form.
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seesaw, you should start to listen better. Your reason is not my reason. My last reply to you was made in disappointment, not agreement. I meant what I said. And I do not just mean the fact that I'd need a reason. I mean the fact that right now I am different than I was a month ago and I first need to figure out what changed, who I am right now. I have been working on a lot of stuff, as always, and am constantly changing, but this here is something stronger for me than the average and I do not need an alter to keep having fun, if it is just fun that one gets out if it. I have never been bored in my life, so no need for those kinds of activities.
You did not really make an answer to the thoughts I expressed in my last post (that was the disappointment). Either way right now I am different than I was just three weeks ago and what I am saying now I would not have said then.
I liked your post and thought along, the topic was something I thought about before but decided not to do. And I did say I'd be up for play in a controlled environment, though not just right this second (as I explained). I am sure it would be fun but I have no idea right now who I should be in this game. Without that I cannot play along. I can play the new me but that is what I am doing right now.. so not what you had in mind. But for me that is the same as playing anything new. I think you could count that/this, since I feel like I left myself somewhere round the corner . But if you think about what I am saying and put yourself in my shoes I think you could understand.. I am actually trying to go along and see where what boundaries are now, which is a full time job.
I might get back to you on your proposal, and like I said before I do value the fact that you made it in a sincere and serious spirit. I just have enough on my hands right now in that specific department. Plus I am currently a bit tired by this site, so not the best time to do this. Hope I made myself clear enough this time and sorry that my last reply was not clear, I just did not want to edit it and state the fact that I expected more in terms of a reply from you. Did not want to be rude hahaha.
But I will still think about it. If you have this controlled environment do let me know, I might know how I want to play by then. Also don't expect me to announce it, I think it will be better if you have no idea it is happening.. otherwise it is not that much fun. Thnx again for giving me that freedom .
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hm, it just occurred to me that we could do this in the New Seers chat room. It would be most convenient, in real time with boundaries of start and stop and most of all - fun. But I still need a bit to come to terms as to what/who exactly I want to be. I think I know, something I was trying before but always eludes me by just a hair's breath . heh. but not sure if it is enough of a challenge..
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