SELF-Importance

[Nu Lang]

"a sorcerer should cultivate self-importance"





no no no!!! A sorcerer needs sobriety. Or else he/she can easily be trapped.

[dreamways]

Nu Lang wrote:"a sorcerer should cultivate self-importance"





no no no!!! A sorcerer needs sobriety. Or else he/she can easily be trapped.
No, that is only for nagualism, not regular sorcery.

[Nu Lang]

But this website is primarily focused on advancing nagualism...main page reads:

Here we are dedicated to advancing the teachings of
nagualism. To explore the knowledge brought out by Carlos Castaneda and
to advance upon
its foundation. To push the boundries of dreaming and above all, to
make each person aware of their totality and human potential.

[dreamways]

Nu Lang wrote:But this website is primarily focused on advancing nagualism...main page reads:

Here we are dedicated to advancing the teachings of
nagualism. To explore the knowledge brought out by Carlos Castaneda and
to advance upon
its foundation. To push the boundries of dreaming and above all, to
make each person aware of their totality and human potential.


I guess that LoneWolf wants the sight to be about nagualism then, but he personally follows inorganic beings, not Don Juan or any other nagual. Inorganic beings do not practice nagualism, they do not teach nagualism, nor do they intentionally aid nagualists in their quest for freedom. Inorganic sorcery is pure, original sorcery, the thing that branched off into the death defier paths as well as nagualism. Don Juan has told me, in dreaming, that every sorcerer should at least give nagualism a try before deciding not to do it, as he believes freedom is the greatest calling for them. I have chosen to be a nagualist personally, as I feel more comfortable with it than any other path, but if somebody feels more comfortable with straight sorcery then I believe they should go with that.

[Nu Lang]

Ok, reading this you wrote here helps me understand what you are trying to work out.



Yes, NLW had inorganic teacher(s), but he was born a nagual being as he told you, and when he read Castaneda he saw how it all aligned, and he was able to make use of DJ's teachings which resonated with him already. Notice how he states "To explore the knowledge brought out by Carlos Castaneda and to advance upon its foundation." He is in agreement with the teachings of Don Juan. So its the same as having him as your teacher, the outcome is the same. This much I know from reading his posts, hearing from him...if any thing I say here is wrong he can correct me and also fill in any details.

[dreamways]

Nu Lang wrote:Ok, reading this you wrote here helps me understand what you are trying to work out.

Yes, NLW had inorganic teacher(s), but he was born a nagual being as he told you, and when he read Castaneda he saw how it all aligned, and he was able to make use of DJ's teachings which resonated with him already. Notice how he states "To explore the knowledge brought out by Carlos Castaneda and to advance upon its foundation." He is in agreement with the teachings of Don Juan. So its the same as having him as your teacher, the outcome is the same. This much I know from reading his posts, hearing from him...if any thing I say here is wrong he can correct me and also fill in any details.
Yes, I'm just going on what he has said to me, that his teachers are inorganic beings, not Don Juan, and that he is not a nagualist but an inorganic sorcerer. I was as shocked as you are to discover this, but as he pointed out, he wasn't keeping it a secret. What I am trying to encourage him to do is champion the cause of all inorganic sorcerers, since he is one, and at least make part of his forum dedicated to this, as it is his lineage. There are others out there exactly like him and they deserve their own forum as much as nagualists do, and if LoneWolf doesn't do this for them then who will? I've already done as much as I can for inorganic sorcerers and it isn't even my path. There is a lot of stuff on this forum that has nothing to do with sorcery or nagualism and if it was up to me I would just delete all of it without even thinking twice about it. I mean, who gives a *** about zen anyway. And if inorganic beings aren't demanding that you lose self-importance then why borrow that issue from nagualism and apply it where it doesn't belong.  There is just a lot of clutter here that doesn't help the causes at all, not mine, and certainly not LoneWolf's.

[Nu Lang]

dreamways wrote:Yes, I'm just going on what he has said to me, that his teachers are inorganic beings, not Don Juan, and that he is not a nagualist but an inorganic sorcerer.
Dreamways...I may fish up some more quotes...but out of time right now...here is one though from Silvereye...
Nagual LoneWolf wrote:I am Lone Wolf. A man, a hunter, warrior, and one who has lived with the nagual spirit his whole life.

[dreamways]

Nu Lang wrote:dreamways wrote:Yes, I'm just going on what he has said to me, that his teachers are inorganic beings, not Don Juan, and that he is not a nagualist but an inorganic sorcerer.
Dreamways...I may fish up some more quotes...but out of time right now...here is one though from Silvereye...
Nagual LoneWolf wrote:I am Lone Wolf. A man, a hunter, warrior, and one who has lived with the nagual spirit his whole life.


Well he can jump into this discussion at any time of course and tell me he is practicing nagualism now. Keep in mind that there are also people here who follow harmless death defier paths, different from the black hand insect tensegrity type, who deserve their own forum, in my opinion, but that is going to require somebody else to do it besides LW or I. Death defier sorcerers also have an inorganic foundation, like nagualists, but do not seek freedom, which is the same as pure inorganic sorcerers.

[Nu Lang]

Well, I've just heard him say countless times he's a nagual (note his name, lol) and follows nagualism. Its written at various places here on this forum...I'll leave it at that.


"Keep in mind that there are also people here who follow harmless death defier paths, different from the black hand insect tensegrity type, who deserve their own forum, in my opinion, but that is going to require somebody else to do it besides LW or I."


Yeah if anyone with a particular background shows up then perhaps a sub forum? And yes, this forum is intended to be diverse...here is what is written by LW in introductions...


"This forum embraces all spiritual pursuits including Zen, Toltec Teachings, Nagualism, Shamanism, Christian beliefs, Hinduism, Yoga, Druidic lore, Indian Beliefs, Magic (Black &White), Sorcery, (Warlockism), Etc."

[Augusto Esposito]

I would like to add to the self-importance thread that nagualists & other sorceric paths regard self-importance as a hindrance-that-is-part-of-being-alive.


In other words, self-importance is something to work around with, for it can't be defeated fully. Other paths may disagree.


It's not like being an arrogant son of a **** is bad per se, but it is energy-consuming. Some can afford it though. I wouldn't recommend it myself. I'm even careful about the warriorship affair, for the vast majority of nagual practitioners and enthusiasts fall into the temptation of taking the war outside of them, which is a big mistake. If you feel like challenging everything and everyone, think again, for you are bound to find someone that will take on your challenge and potentially destroy you. Failure is not an option for warriors, but it sure as hell is a possibility.


Discretion is the better part of valour. I'm yet to find one nagual that doesn't think he is better than most or everybody. I call that the marine-mentality. Not that it is my problem, their arrogance keeps them from growing and brings them all kinds of trouble. It's their choice. There are other ways that have less or zero war-attitude. The question is where do you want to go.


As for forums, I for one have been told many times that forums are a thing purely of the tonal and they should be avoided. And no, it wasn't my mom who told me that.

[Guest]

Esposito,

The nagual is evrrywhere, hence there is no place or thing that is purely tonal.

But you know this.

[Nu Lang]

Ah, Augusto...you like controversy...

[Nu Lang]

Ah Augusto...you are the member also know as Grand Speculator...among other names.

[Augusto Esposito]

Is that a secret?


FYI: I was adding up to what Dreamways said, actually. 

For controversy ya all can talk to the hand, as the saying goes.


Nothing else.

[Nu Lang]

Its a secret for a lot of members here yes.



I'm not saying controversy is negative, but that you highlighted it rather. When controversy arises, we each decide to follow its trail or not. It can be a good exercise in discipline. It depends too.

[dreamways]

Nu Lang wrote:here is what is written by LW in introductions...


"This forum embraces all spiritual pursuits including Zen, Toltec Teachings, Nagualism, Shamanism, Christian beliefs, Hinduism, Yoga, Druidic lore, Indian Beliefs, Magic (Black &White), Sorcery, (Warlockism), Etc."

Sorry LW, your mission statement goes against common sense, and only fools argue against common sense.

[dreamways]

I only accept inorganic paths, and everything else I just force myself to tolerate.

[Lunoor]

I met Common Sense once, she doesn't say anything...minds her own business.



She doesn't need a temple to adorn her, doesn't take candy from babies, don't go by no name, not into fame~left blame where she found it



She walks quietly through the woods

She goes barefoot

and in meadows the grass

can be seen between

her toe parts

[Guest]

Sorcerers have their own rules to abide by, so you don't have to get involved with the rules of non-sorcerers

[Guest]

Self-importance is our greatest enemy. Think about it - what weakens us is feeling offended by the deeds and misdeeds of our fellowmen. Our self-importance requires that we spend most of our lives offended by someone. ~CC

[Guest]

"You will learn that you increase your burdens and decrease the
likelihood of success by taking yourself too seriously.
Nothing can take
precedence over the work of your status sphere — this world or the
next. Very important is the work of preparation for the next higher
sphere, but nothing equals the importance of the work of the world in
which you are actually living.
 But though the work is
important, the self is not.
When you feel important, you lose
energy to the wear and tear of ego dignity so that there is little
energy left to do the work.
Self-importance, not work-importance,
exhausts immature creatures; it is the self element that exhausts, not
the effort to achieve.
You can do important work if you do not become
self-important; you can do several things as easily as one if you leave
yourself out. Variety is restful; monotony is what wears and exhausts.
 Day after day is alike — just life or the alternative of death."
UB

[Guest]

" When we are tempted to magnify
our self-importance, if we stop to contemplate the infinity of the
greatness and grandeur of our Makers, our own self-glorification becomes
sublimely ridiculous, even verging on the humorous.
One of the
functions of humor is to help all of us take ourselves less seriously.

Humor
is the divine antidote for exaltation of ego. "

[ninth octave]

rdu wrote:

" When we are tempted to magnify our self-importance, if we stop to contemplate the infinity of the greatness and grandeur of our Makers, our own self-glorification becomes sublimely ridiculous, even verging on the humorous.
One of the functions of humor is to help all of us take ourselves less seriously.

Humor is the divine antidote for exaltation of ego. "Reminds me of all the fart jokes and silly shenanigans of Genero and DJ as they tried to rid CC of his "indulgent"behaviors.though CC was naturally a funny guy.

[Guest]

In discussing spirit humor, first let me tell you what it is not. Spirit jest is never tinged with the accentuation of the misfortunes of the weak and erring. Neither is it ever blasphemous of the righteousness and glory of divinity. Our humor embraces three general levels of appreciation:
1.    Reminiscent jests. Quips growing out of the memories of past episodes in one's experience of combat, struggle, and sometimes fearfulness, and ofttimes foolish and childish anxiety. To us, this phase of humor derives from the deep-seated and abiding ability to draw upon the past for memory material with which pleasantly to flavor and otherwise lighten the heavy loads of the present.
2.    Current humor. The senselessness of much that so often causes us serious concern, the joy at discovering the unimportance of much of our serious personal anxiety. We are most appreciative of this phase of humor when we are best able to discount the anxieties of the present in favor of the certainties of the future.
3.    Prophetic joy. It will perhaps be difficult for mortals to envisage this phase of humor, but we do get a peculiar satisfaction out of the assurance "that all things work together for good"—for spirits and morontians as well as for mortals. This aspect of celestial humor grows out of our faith in the loving overcare of our superiors and in the divine stability of our Supreme Directors.

...
Even mortal humor becomes most hearty when it depicts episodes affecting those just a little beneath one's present developmental state, or when it portrays one's supposed superiors falling victim to the experiences which are commonly associated with supposed inferiors. You of Urantia have allowed much that is at once vulgar and unkind to become confused with your humor, but on the whole, you are to be congratulated on a comparatively keen sense of humor. Some of your races have a rich vein of it and are greatly helped in their earthly careers thereby. Apparently you received much in the way of humor from your Adamic inheritance, much more than was secured of either music or art.

...
The higher the mortal species, the greater the stress and the greater the capacity for humor as well as the necessity for it.
...

Humor should function as an automatic safety valve to prevent the building up of excessive pressures due to the monotony of sustained and serious self-contemplation in association with the intense struggle for developmental progress and noble achievement. Humor also functions to lessen the shock of the unexpected impact of fact or of truth, rigid unyielding fact and flexible ever-living truth. The mortal personality, never sure as to which will next be encountered, through humor swiftly grasps—sees the point and achieves insight—the unexpected nature of the situation be it fact or be it truth.
While the humor of Urantia is exceedingly crude and most inartistic, it does serve a valuable purpose both as a health insurance and as a liberator of emotional pressure, thus preventing injurious nervous tension and overserious self-contemplation.

-an Archangel of Nebadon

[Guest]

rdu wrote:In discussing spirit humor, first let me tell you what it is not. Spirit
jest is never tinged with the accentuation of the misfortunes of the
weak and erring. Neither is it ever blasphemous of the righteousness and
glory of divinity. Our humor embraces three general levels of
appreciation: