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Howard Y. Lee, Castaneda's Reluctant New Nagual
#1
Before Castaneda started teaching Tensegrity through Cleargreen, he had tried to convince Howard Lee to do it, to take over everything upon his death.
Carlos made one small miscalculation though, he introduced Howard to the Death Defier and Howard didn't like him, so much so that he refused any connection
with him, abandoning everything that was being handed over to him, which was literally everything Castaneda had to give. But, all was not lost, the arrangement
just needed to be tweaked a bit and the problem was solved.... http://www.thelightoflife.com/
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#2
So... what was the new deal?
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#3
...over the web suggest that Howard Y. Lee rejected any involvement with Castaneda and his party because he saw them unstable. I read that after learning from
Castaneda he saw that many of the people coming out from tensegrity were energetically fucked up and he healed many of them.
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#4
grandspeculator wrote:

...over the web suggest that Howard Y. Lee rejected any involvement with Castaneda and his party because he saw them unstable. I read that after learning
from Castaneda he saw that many of the people coming out from tensegrity were energetically fucked up and he healed many of them.


Yep. So he started teaching his own version of tensegrity, his own enegetic path. Castaneda worked him like a puppet. http://www.thelightoflife.com/
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#5
That sounds far fetched. He wasn't impeccable enough to do an act of controlled folly of that degree.




Now, if you say that it was the Intent of the Spirit... that's a whole different subject.




Things worked in spite of Castaneda, not because of him. The Nagual teachings are a living tradition, but that particular line ended with him.




The Eagle, it seems, can do without him. A new wave of independent seers is now feed by his works.




But, as I said on another tread:




Carlos, with his training, could have done far better, live to be a hundred and twenty and write a dozen more books. Julian lived that long, and he was eaten
by the eagle!
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#6
grandspeculator wrote:

That sounds far fetched. He wasn't impeccable enough to do an act of controlled folly of that degree.



Castaneda invented "Carlos", "impeccability", and "controlled folly." All you know is what he told you to know.
Dance, puppet, dance! http://www.thelightoflife.com/
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#7
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#8
If you ever met Howard Y. Lee in person, it would become obvious pretty quick that he was everything that Carlos was not, he was the poster child of what you
think a nagual should be, physically, mentally, spiritually. Carlos himself said that Howard reminded him of Don Juan. Howard had acted as Carlos'
personal healer for years, eventually falling into the role of on-call energy doctor for the tensegrity seminars. It was all true, of course, but just a
little bit too perfect, a little too well scripted, just like the new nagual himself. He was definitely a nagual for a new generation of sorcerers, the type
of people who demand that their expectations are met precisely. http://www.thelightoflife.com/eng/aboutNRG.php
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#9
Howard Y. Lee is not what I personally think that a Nagual should be.




Again... not the controlled folly of Castaneda.




But I'll grant you a thing: Yes, without Castaneda, we would not know squat about the nagual path.




But then again... writing his books was his particular intent or the intent of the spirit?
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#10
grandspeculator
wrote:

But I'll grant you a thing: Yes, without Castaneda, we would not know squat about the nagual path.


But then again... writing his books was his particular intent or the intent of the spirit?

Well, you only have two choices here, either just follow the spirit or try to unravel the spirit. I don't think that anyone could be as
effective as Castaneda was without just going with it. The level of fear that Castaneda had instilled in Howard Lee was just amazing. At the time, I
didn't understand what was going on, so I was profoundly disapointed in Howard. The spirit did make sure that everything turned out the way it was
supposed to, but, it just seemed like Howard was a total chicken-****-coward and fraud when he expressed his true feelings about the death defier. I thought,
how can a kung fu grand master be afraid of a ghost?
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#11
A ghost?




Well... for one thing, you can't punch the guts out of a "ghost".




The Death Defier remains a controversial subject, to say the least... the old seer slash immortal vampire slash father/mother of the lineage of the new seers.
For most people this kind of individual is the worst that you can find... yet he/she started this whole thing.




If he/she were a more "ideal" teacher perhaps it would be easier to digest.




It doesn't matter anyway. The Spirit doesn't take volunteers.
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#12
grandspeculator
wrote:

A ghost? Well... for one thing, you can't punch the guts out of a "ghost".


The Death Defier remains a controversial subject, to say the least... the old seer slash immortal vampire slash father/mother of the lineage of the new
seers. For most people this kind of individual is the worst that you can find... yet he/she started this whole thing.


If he/she were a more "ideal" teacher perhaps it would be easier to digest. It doesn't matter anyway. The Spirit doesn't take volunteers.



The thing is, the death defier didn't want Howard. If he did, then he would have gotten him. Carlos only brought an end to the lineage of
the death defier, he merged with the death defier and they both left together as one being. This was Castaneda's fundamental purpose, to remove the death
defier from the lineage, sacrificing himself to accomplish it. So, now things are back to normal. I did not tell Howard this because I was and am a student
of the death defier, above and beyond anyone else. I saw Howard as an ingrate and whining ****, I didn't want to help him in anyway. But, it really
isn't anybody's fault, the spirit guided everything to work out the way it did. My opinion of anyone is just my opinion. I may not like Howard, but I
figured it was time to at least go on the record about this, sort of get it off my chest. It may or may not be of any value to anyone, but I'm trying not
to withhold any information that I have anymore. Ya, I'm sure Howard would have loved to "punch the guts out" of the tenant, lol. The death
defier got the last laugh anyway, but that's another story.
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#13
This was Castaneda's fundamental purpose, to remove the death defier from the lineage, sacrificing himself to accomplish it. So, now things are back to
normal.
That's rather sad and pathetic. They were mediocre already before the Death Defier and after all his contributions Castaneda pushed him/er out
of the line?




If anything is worth something of Castaneda, it's the possibility of meeting with the Death Defier!




What a dumb move! That's self-importance. He wanted to be so great in the eyes of DJ that he didn't asked anything from the DD in exchange for his
energy. And years after he pushed the DD out?




Idiotic. And Lee thinks he will live to be a 150, without the help of the DD... good luck with that!
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#14
While we are at it, I might as well ask...




Why the Death Defier only takes life-energy from male naguals?
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#15
grandspeculator
wrote:




This was Castaneda's fundamental purpose, to remove the death defier from the lineage, sacrificing himself to accomplish it. So, now things are back to
normal.
That's rather sad and pathetic. They were mediocre already before the Death Defier and after all his contributions Castaneda pushed him/er
out of the line?


If anything is worth something of Castaneda, it's the possibility of meeting with the Death Defier!


What a dumb move! That's self-importance. He wanted to be so great in the eyes of DJ that he didn't asked anything from the DD in exchange for his
energy. And years after he pushed the DD out?


Idiotic. And Lee thinks he will live to be a 150, without the help of the DD... good luck with that!

The way I see it, you gotta have a nagual leader who can channel the necessary energy. At this point in time, if you want to be directly
connected to don juan's lineage then you have no other choice but howard lee. That certainly doesn't mean that there aren't other lineages, but,
my knowledge is strictly focused on the lineages of don juan and the death defier, I don't really have any recommendations about other possible avenues.
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#16
Don Juan was fine, but the Death Defier knows more, better and is not as uptight.
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#17
grandspeculator wrote:



Don Juan was fine, but the Death Defier knows more, better and is not as uptight.





As you might have guessed by now, we don't really have a choice when it comes to following in the footsteps of don juan or that of the death defier,
apparently, we are born leaning towards either orthodox or modern sorcery, I don't think there is any point in fighting it.
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#18
dreamways
wrote:


[b][b][b][b][b]grandspeculator[/b][/b][/b][/b]
wrote:[/b]




And Lee thinks he will live to be a 150, without the help of the DD... good luck with that!


Getting old, sick, surviving a bit longer and dying eventually is a trick everyone can do. Physical longevity is for science to deal with. I
gauge spiritual leaders by the energy they transmit, their ability to teach without saying anything. Howard Lee has that ability, he's just not playing
the music that interests me. He has much to offer other people though, and they should take advantage of it while it is available, if it resonates with them.
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#19
I was personally drawn to the nagual path because of the death defier... not because of Carlos or Don Juan.




I was surprised that not one of the lineage of the new seers asked as a gift of power how to become a death defier. Strange...




Again: Why the Death Defier only takes life-energy from male naguals?
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#20
dreamways wrote:


dreamways
wrote:


[b][b][b][b][b]grandspeculator[/b][/b][/b][/b]
wrote:[/b]




Getting old, sick, surviving a bit longer and dying eventually is a trick everyone can do. Physical longevity is for science to deal with. I
gauge spiritual leaders by the energy they transmit, their ability to teach without saying anything. Howard Lee has that ability, he's just not playing
the music that interests me. He has much to offer other people though, and they should take advantage of it while it is available, if it resonates with them.





He may live to be a 100, a 120... but a 150 is beyond his actual potential.
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#21
grandspeculator wrote:

I was personally drawn to the nagual path because of the death defier... not because of Carlos or Don Juan.


I was surprised that not one of the lineage of the new seers asked as a gift of power how to become a death defier. Strange...


Again: Why the Death Defier only takes life-energy from male naguals?
Male energy is used by the insect-like death defiers and female energy is used by the tree-like death defiers; the person giving the energy has to
be a double being only, they don't have to be a nagual. The single death defier that took the energy of the naguals in don juan's lineage was using it
to guide the direction of the lineage as well as sustain himself. He was a black hand sorcerer, the type who resonate with an insect-like energy.
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#22
Male energy is used by the insect-like death defiers and female energy is used by the tree-like death defiers; the person giving the energy has to be a
double being only, they don't have to be a nagual. The single death defier that took the energy of the naguals in don juan's lineage was using it to
guide the direction of the lineage as well as sustain himself. He was a black hand sorcerer, the type who resonate with an insect-like energy.
Nice!
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#23
The DD was remixed by the feminine universe that preys on the masculine energy that is its prey. Predators eat what taste good.
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#24
Nagual LoneWolf wrote:

The DD was remixed by the feminine universe that preys on the masculine energy that is its prey. Predators eat what taste good.


Yep, but it is not an absolute proportion. 1% of all death defiers are female "tree sorcerers."
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#25
According to the "nagual scriptures" the Death Defier's idea behind taking energy from naguals is about closing the gap that allows death to
enter our coccon and take us away.






How long does a single "energy drink" last in a Death Defier's energy configuration?
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