Why do you think Carlos went nuts with power?

[Sacateca]

Castaneda couldn't internalize the lessons on self-importance and it eventually did him in. Plus too many idiots wanted him as their leader. Then they go to SR and complain when they find out that their great leader tried to be a 'don Juan', but just couldn't make the cut.
Oh, Corey Donovan sure didn't like me pointing that out. I openly said that after going to a Tensegrity workshop I was determined that I NEVER wanted to get too close to those witches. I wasn't that dumb, but Corey & Jeremy and the **** crybabies were that dumb. Plus they refused to take responsibility for becoming members of the Castaneda cult. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
They went from blindly believing Castaneda to blindly believing people like DeMille
Idiots to the core!

[Archaos]

I'm of a similar view as cabbageman. I notice throughout the books DJ's warnings to CC that he

was more like the old sorcerers than the new. So it is not surprising to me how CC acted.

Especially considering the knowledge that sex lets a man feed off a woman's energy for 7 years,

this would be a smart move for a sorcerer - to have sex with as many women as possible.

We must understand that sorcerers are not concerned with morality but with impeccability,

which means ENERGY, not good behavior.

And going back to the first post of this thread, we are also not concerned with lies:



"I'm not concerned with lies or truths," he said severely. "Lies are lies only if you have personal history."



Every critic mentions the lies and sex... as if Carlos ever claimed to be a man of morals or something.

I do not condone his acts, nor condemn them. I'm just saying they are "reasonable" within the context of the teachings.

If people are outraged, perhaps they should have read the books more carefully.

Carlos consistently behaved as the old sorcerers.

[Nagual LoneWolf]

Nice perpective and something Ive been arguing with others about for many years.

[Guest]

Yes, I agree too. Only thing I think about is...any realm one passes too, past eagle, cannot be composed of all alike beings.

[cabbageman]

Hey Archaos,

Where did you read/learn that if I may ask?

[Archaos]

cabbageman wrote:

Hey Archaos,



Where did you read/learn that if I may ask? 
Hi Cabbageman!
lol! I lost my coordinates and thought I was responding to the "what happens after death" thread.
I bet that was confusing if anyone read it.
In his books. Do you mean specifically which ones? Cuz that would take some searching.

[watergaze]

nope, i found it interesting.



I wanted to look up that thing you mentioned.. the school or system or what it was. could you maybe write that name again?

[Archaos]

Hi Watergaze!
Ramtha School of Enlightenment.

I have to say, it's not the same as when i used to go.
A lot of people say that.
But you can still get the basics I mentioned - even in books.
But you wouldn't get the disciplines and initiation without attending.
Since this looks weird now, what happened was I thought Cabbageman was asking where
I learned about the stuff I said about after life (or after death) and I went on about the
electromagnetic spectrum and things i learned and experienced at RSE and how it relates
to Castaneda and the Eagle...
When i realised my error, I edited all that out.

[watergaze]

thnx,

I know that is what happened. But i think the first answer you gave was more interesting than the second and both were possible answers, within reason, to his question .

Plus what you know you know from more sources.. and your opinion is those combined and pitted against your personal experience.. so.. it made sense

[Archaos]

I meant the explanation for others.

The school had nothing to do with what cabbageman asked me.

All that info is in Castaneda's books, or Taisha and Florinda's maybe with the part about

being able to feed off a woman's energy for 7 years after intercourse.





I'm happy you appreciated my other post though - a happy accident!

[cabbageman]

Archaos wrote:Especially considering the knowledge that sex lets a man feed off a woman's energy for 7 years,

this would be a smart move for a sorcerer - to have sex with as many women as possible."
I wanted to know where you got this from. DJ gave me the impression in his books that the less sex the better.

[Archaos]

cabbageman wrote:

Archaos wrote:

Especially considering the knowledge that sex lets a man feed off a woman's energy for 7 years,
this would be a smart move for a sorcerer - to have sex with as many women as possible."
I wanted to know where you got this from. DJ gave me the impression in his books that the less sex the better. 

That may be true for some, but not for a 3 pronged nagual who saw he wouldn't accomplish his task
in his own lifetime.
My choice of words "smart move" is relative of course. I'm just saying he needed energy and sex is a "sad"
alternative to impeccability, but still practical to a degree.

"An empty man uses the completeness of a woman all the time," she went on. "A complete woman is dangerous in her completeness, more so than a man. She is unreliable, moody, nervous, but also capable of great changes. Women like that can pick themselves up and go anywhere. They'll do nothing there, but that's because they had nothing going to begin with. Empty people, on the other hand, can't jump like that anymore, but they're more reliable. The Nagual said that empty people are like worms that look around before moving a bit and then they back up and then they move a little bit more again. Complete people always jump, somersault and almost always land on their heads, but it doesn't matter to them."
I don't know where the quote is Cabbageman. You'll have to search it yourself unless someone else offers.
In googling, several people mention it. Maybe Florinda's book - she speaks of absinence for 7 years.
Here's a link that i didn't read but it should be in there somewhere.
http://sustainedaction.org/Chronologies ... rindaV.htm
If anyone thinks Carlos' actions were inappropriate, here is some context that doesn't make sex look so bad:

"Once she had killed you, your luminosity would have increased her power and she would then have come after us. I was the only one who knew that. Lidia, Josefina and Rosa love her. I don't. I knew what her designs were. She would have taken us one by one, in her own time, since she had nothing to lose and everything to gain. The Nagual said to me that there was no other way for her. He entrusted me with the girls and told me what to do in case Soledad killed you and came after our luminosity. He figured that I had a chance to save myself and to save perhaps one of the three. You see, Soledad is not a bad woman at all; she's simply doing what an impeccable warrior would do. The little sisters like her more than they like their own mothers. She's a real mother to them. That was, the Nagual said, the point of her advantage. I haven't been able to pull the little sisters away from her, no matter what I do. So if she had killed you, she would then have taken at least two of those three trusting souls. Then without you in the picture Pablito is nothing. Soledad would have squashed him like a bug. And then with all her completeness and power she would have entered into that world out there. If I had been in her place I would've tried to do exactly as she did."

[cabbageman]

Thanks man, I really appreciate it

[Gonzo]

From P31ff, "The Fire From Within"


There was a long pause. Don Juan's eyes had an intense shine. They seemed to be looking at

me from a great depth. I had the feeling that each of his eyes was an independent point of

brilliance. For an instant he appeared to be struggling against an invisible force, a fire from within

that intended to consume him. It passed and he went on talking.

"The degree of awareness of every individual sentient being," he continued, "depends on the

degree to which it is capable of letting the pressure of the emanations at large carry it."

After a long interruption, don Juan continued explaining. He said that seers saw that from the

moment of conception awareness is enhanced, enriched, by the process of being alive. He said

that seers saw, for instance, that the awareness of an individual insect or that of an individual man

grows from the moment of conception in astoundingly different ways, but with equal consistency.

"Is it from the moment of conception or from the moment of birth that awareness develops?" I

asked.

"Awareness develops from the moment of conception," he replied. "I have always told you

that sexual energy is something of ultimate importance and that it has to be controlled and used

with great care. But you have always resented what I said, because you thought I was speaking of

control in terms of morality; I always meant it in terms of saving and rechanneling energy."

Don Juan looked at Genaro. Genaro nodded his head in approval.

"Genaro is going to tell you what our benefactor, the nagual Julian, used to say about saving

and rechanneling sexual energy," don Juan said to me.

"The nagual Julian used to say that to have sex is a matter of energy," Genaro began. "For

instance, he never had any problems having sex, because he had bushels of energy. But he took

one look at me and prescribed right away that my peter was just for peeing. He told me that I

didn't have enough energy to have sex. He said that my parents were too bored and too tired when

they made me; he said that I was the result of very boring sex, cojida aburrida. I was born like

that, bored and tired. The nagual Julian recommended that people like me should never have sex;

this way we can store the little energy we have.

"He said the same thing to Silvio Manuel and to Emilito. He saw that the others had enough

energy. They were not the result of bored sex. He told them that they could do anything they

wanted with their sexual energy, but he recommended that they control themselves and

understand the Eagle's command that sex is for bestowing the glow of awareness. We all said we

had understood.

"One day, without any warning at all, he opened the curtain of the other world with the help of

his own benefactor, the nagual Elias, and pushed all of us inside, with no hesitation whatsoever.

All of us, except Silvio Manuel, nearly died in there. We had no energy to withstand the impact

of the other world. None of us, except Silvio Manuel, had followed the nagual's

recommendation."

"What is the curtain of the other world?" I asked don Juan.

"What Genaro said - it is a curtain," don Juan replied. "But you're getting off the subject. You

always do. We're talking about the Eagle's command about sex. It is the Eagle's command that

sexual energy be used for creating life. Through sexual energy, the eagle bestows awareness. So

when sentient beings are engaged in sexual intercourse, the emanations inside their cocoons do

their best to bestow awareness to the new sentient being they are creating."

He said that during the sexual act, the emanations encased inside the cocoon of both partners

undergo a profound agitation, the culminating point of which is a merging, a fusing of two pieces

of the glow of awareness, one from each partner, that separate from their cocoons.

"Sexual intercourse is always a bestowal of awareness even though the bestowal may not be

consolidated," he went on. "The emanations inside the cocoon of human beings don't know of

intercourse for fun."

Genaro leaned over toward me from his chair across the table and talked to me in a low voice,

shaking his head for emphasis.

"The nagual is telling you the truth," he said and winked at me. "Those emanations really don't

know."

Don Juan fought not to laugh and added that the fallacy of man is to act with total disregard

for the mystery of existence and to believe that such a sublime act of bestowing life and

awareness is merely a physical drive that one can twist at will.

Genaro made obscene sexual gestures, twisting his pelvis around, on and on. Don Juan nodded

and said that that was exactly what he meant. Genaro thanked him for acknowledging his one and

only contribution to the explanation of awareness.

Both of them laughed like idiots, saying that if I had known how serious their benefactor was

about the explanation of awareness, I would be laughing with them.

I earnestly asked don Juan what all this meant for an average man in the day-to-day world.

"You mean what Genaro is doing?" he asked me in mock seriousness.

Their glee was always contagious. It took a long time for them to calm down. Their level of

energy was so high that next to them, I seemed old and decrepit.

"I really don't know," don Juan finally answered me. "All I know is what it means to warriors.

They know that the only real energy we possess is a life-bestowing sexual energy. This

knowledge makes them permanently conscious of their responsibility.

"If warriors want to have enough energy to see, they must become misers with their sexual

energy. That was the lesson the nagual Julian gave us. He pushed us into the unknown, and we all

nearly died. Since everyone of us wanted to see, we, of course, abstained from wasting our glow

of awareness."

of awareness."

I had heard him voice that belief before. Every time he did, we got into an argument. I always

felt compelled to protest and raise objections to what I thought was a puritanical attitude toward

sex.

I again raised my objections. Both of them laughed to tears.

"What can be done with man's natural sensuality?" I asked don Juan.

"Nothing," he replied. "There is nothing wrong with man's sensuality, it's man's ignorance of

and disregard for his magical nature that is wrong. It's a mistake to waste recklessly the life-

bestowing force of sex and not have children, but it's also a mistake not to know that in having

children one taxes the glow of awareness."

"How do seers know that having children taxes the glow of awareness?" I asked.

"They see that on having a child, the parents' glow of awareness diminishes and the child's

increases. In some supersensitive, frail parents, the glow of awareness almost disappears. As

children enhance their awareness, a big dark spot develops in the luminous cocoon of the parents,

on the very place from which the glow was taken away. It is usually on the midsection of the

cocoon. Sometimes those spots can even be seen superimposed on the body itself."

I asked him if there was anything that could be done to give people a more balanced

understanding of the glow of awareness.

"Nothing," he said. "At least, there is nothing that seers can do. Seers aim to be free, to be

unbiased witnesses incapable of passing judgment; otherwise they would have to assume the

responsibility for bringing about a more adjusted cycle. No one can do that. The new cycle, if it is

to come, must come of itself."

[cabbageman]

Thank you sir!

[Peacefulwarrior]

Hi all! I found this forum a couple of hours ago and I am very pleased to meet you. It is such an honor. Woops... "a man of knowledge has no honor." Well, I can't say that I am a man of knowledge myself. But I am struggling to become one. I searched the forum for "new here", but I couldn't find such a topic that's why I am introducing myself in here. I've red all the information on www.prismagems.com and am currently studying it as well reading The Teachings of Don Juan, Journey to Ixtlan, Tales of Power, The Second Ring of Power (not full yet) and Magical Passes.



Dear docta lee, as far as I know Carlos didn't go nuts with power, but I cannot state that for certain. I have to research the subject. What I know is that dreamways says in nagula.yuku.com that he is still alive and that he never died and burnt with the fire from within.

[Peacefulwarrior]

Gonzo wrote:From P31ff, "The Fire From Within"
There was a long pause. Don Juan's eyes had an intense shine. They seemed to be looking at

me from a great depth. I had the feeling that each of his eyes was an independent point of

brilliance. For an instant he appeared to be struggling against an invisible force, a fire from within

that intended to consume him. It passed and he went on talking.

"The degree of awareness of every individual sentient being," he continued, "depends on the

degree to which it is capable of letting the pressure of the emanations at large carry it."

After a long interruption, don Juan continued explaining. He said that seers saw that from the

moment of conception awareness is enhanced, enriched, by the process of being alive. He said

that seers saw, for instance, that the awareness of an individual insect or that of an individual man

grows from the moment of conception in astoundingly different ways, but with equal consistency.

"Is it from the moment of conception or from the moment of birth that awareness develops?" I

asked.

"Awareness develops from the moment of conception," he replied. "I have always told you

that sexual energy is something of ultimate importance and that it has to be controlled and used

with great care. But you have always resented what I said, because you thought I was speaking of

control in terms of morality; I always meant it in terms of saving and rechanneling energy."

Don Juan looked at Genaro. Genaro nodded his head in approval.

"Genaro is going to tell you what our benefactor, the nagual Julian, used to say about saving

and rechanneling sexual energy," don Juan said to me.

"The nagual Julian used to say that to have sex is a matter of energy," Genaro began. "For

instance, he never had any problems having sex, because he had bushels of energy. But he took

one look at me and prescribed right away that my peter was just for peeing. He told me that I

didn't have enough energy to have sex. He said that my parents were too bored and too tired when

they made me; he said that I was the result of very boring sex, cojida aburrida. I was born like

that, bored and tired. The nagual Julian recommended that people like me should never have sex;

this way we can store the little energy we have.

"He said the same thing to Silvio Manuel and to Emilito. He saw that the others had enough

energy. They were not the result of bored sex. He told them that they could do anything they

wanted with their sexual energy, but he recommended that they control themselves and

understand the Eagle's command that sex is for bestowing the glow of awareness. We all said we

had understood.

"One day, without any warning at all, he opened the curtain of the other world with the help of

his own benefactor, the nagual Elias, and pushed all of us inside, with no hesitation whatsoever.

All of us, except Silvio Manuel, nearly died in there. We had no energy to withstand the impact

of the other world. None of us, except Silvio Manuel, had followed the nagual's

recommendation."

"What is the curtain of the other world?" I asked don Juan.

"What Genaro said - it is a curtain," don Juan replied. "But you're getting off the subject. You

always do. We're talking about the Eagle's command about sex. It is the Eagle's command that

sexual energy be used for creating life. Through sexual energy, the eagle bestows awareness. So

when sentient beings are engaged in sexual intercourse, the emanations inside their cocoons do

their best to bestow awareness to the new sentient being they are creating."

He said that during the sexual act, the emanations encased inside the cocoon of both partners

undergo a profound agitation, the culminating point of which is a merging, a fusing of two pieces

of the glow of awareness, one from each partner, that separate from their cocoons.

"Sexual intercourse is always a bestowal of awareness even though the bestowal may not be

consolidated," he went on. "The emanations inside the cocoon of human beings don't know of

intercourse for fun."

Genaro leaned over toward me from his chair across the table and talked to me in a low voice,

shaking his head for emphasis.

"The nagual is telling you the truth," he said and winked at me. "Those emanations really don't

know."

Don Juan fought not to laugh and added that the fallacy of man is to act with total disregard

for the mystery of existence and to believe that such a sublime act of bestowing life and

awareness is merely a physical drive that one can twist at will.

Genaro made obscene sexual gestures, twisting his pelvis around, on and on. Don Juan nodded

and said that that was exactly what he meant. Genaro thanked him for acknowledging his one and

only contribution to the explanation of awareness.

Both of them laughed like idiots, saying that if I had known how serious their benefactor was

about the explanation of awareness, I would be laughing with them.

I earnestly asked don Juan what all this meant for an average man in the day-to-day world.

"You mean what Genaro is doing?" he asked me in mock seriousness.

Their glee was always contagious. It took a long time for them to calm down. Their level of

energy was so high that next to them, I seemed old and decrepit.

"I really don't know," don Juan finally answered me. "All I know is what it means to warriors.

They know that the only real energy we possess is a life-bestowing sexual energy. This

knowledge makes them permanently conscious of their responsibility.

"If warriors want to have enough energy to see, they must become misers with their sexual

energy. That was the lesson the nagual Julian gave us. He pushed us into the unknown, and we all

nearly died. Since everyone of us wanted to see, we, of course, abstained from wasting our glow

of awareness."

of awareness."

I had heard him voice that belief before. Every time he did, we got into an argument. I always

felt compelled to protest and raise objections to what I thought was a puritanical attitude toward

sex.

I again raised my objections. Both of them laughed to tears.

"What can be done with man's natural sensuality?" I asked don Juan.

"Nothing," he replied. "There is nothing wrong with man's sensuality, it's man's ignorance of

and disregard for his magical nature that is wrong. It's a mistake to waste recklessly the life-

bestowing force of sex and not have children, but it's also a mistake not to know that in having

children one taxes the glow of awareness."

"How do seers know that having children taxes the glow of awareness?" I asked.

"They see that on having a child, the parents' glow of awareness diminishes and the child's

increases. In some supersensitive, frail parents, the glow of awareness almost disappears. As

children enhance their awareness, a big dark spot develops in the luminous cocoon of the parents,

on the very place from which the glow was taken away. It is usually on the midsection of the

cocoon. Sometimes those spots can even be seen superimposed on the body itself."

I asked him if there was anything that could be done to give people a more balanced

understanding of the glow of awareness.

"Nothing," he said. "At least, there is nothing that seers can do. Seers aim to be free, to be

unbiased witnesses incapable of passing judgment; otherwise they would have to assume the

responsibility for bringing about a more adjusted cycle. No one can do that. The new cycle, if it is

to come, must come of itself."

[Gonzo]

@PeacefulWarrior

De nada.

[spiderlily]

Peacefulwarrior wrote:. What I know is that dreamways says in nagula.yuku.com that he is still alive and that he never died and burnt with the fire from within.
 
I think that may have been recently re-vised.

[Uncle Jim]

funny Carlos would have a good laugh to that.. where are the nuts ? where is power ? what do you think ?

[Uncle Jim]

who dares to judge Carlos ?

[rosygyro]

CARLOS WENT NUT WITH POWER PURELEY AS A RESULT OF THE SUCESS OF HIS BOOKS.
Had he written one book and left it at that he may have had a chancebut the sheer volume of materials artifacts attributable to him made a powersystemhis many mnay adhoc students all wanted power for themselves and ultimatly this meant thata part of Carlos Totality connected to universal intent became lodged in his books.he bacame immpeccably bound to his works as a responsible being.
There was of course a pivotal day in carlos's life where he could have severed his own awarness from his worksbut the leap to infinity is not a simple thing...and a simple recapitulation of his life..and an attempt to put his books in line, in order and in timebecame dischrodant with his many readers and their confrontation with his boooks in different orders, second hand, duplicate copies.. hell even recorder magnetic tapes..ultimatly this madea PLATFORM for carlos to use for a jump to infinity..the PLATFORM however was a false energy system and carlos became inextricably bound within its mass..
as such parts of carlos are still caught in his works..I believe he may have madea leap to infinityi.e. his awarness may still be completing itself in an immpeccable fashion and oneday may let go of earth totally.. and on that day he may slip past the eagle..but for now.. he is still in process...half inside a dead donkey from what i see!

[delawaredan]

Wasn't that his purpose?  How is this different then Jesus?    I am not comparing Jesus to Carlos regarding their actions, but regarding their impact on the human AP.      I believe Carlos is being crucified in a modern way by all the energetic vampires.   Most are kept in the control of Flyers...their is a chance for a warrior, hopefully even for Carlos.   He will soar past the Eagle when we, the new seers, act in accordance with spirit and live impeccably.   Once you know you are suppose to live impeccably, and you do not live impeccably, you become the petty tyrant.  

I have come to really appreciate the writings of the yellow rose.   You are a smart man rosygyro.

[White Knight]

Hi all, in my opinion nagual Castaneda had done full work of what he set himself to publish. Furthermore the Spirit has descended and Castaneda had a somersault into the inconceivable. He delivered his people. Anyone who have guts and will power can succeed by following his teachings. He is victorious! Long live the Carlos!

[Gestblinde]

Carlos was cut off from the modern sorcerers and left with an Ancient and extremly powerful sorcerer that even Don Juan was uncomfortable around as company..Is it not likely that he more and more came to resemble the Ancient ones which Don Juan described as both odd and scary?